This is a continuation of my thread about damage being broken, here is the link
Basically, I came to the conclusion that damage calculation is a little messed up, but not just on cubecraft, but in all of minecraft, as armor sometimes appears to protect you from damage less than it should, at least on 1.20.
The conclusion/tl:dr is at the end, in case you want to get any results or learn something out of this.
However, with the amount of effort put into making this, I'd really appreciate if you at least tried to read some of this.
So, why would that need a continuation? Because I had another weird incident in one of my eggwars games. So, I am fighting a guy with an iron sword, which according to someone in that old thread doesn't deal 6 damage, but 1+6, as the swords description in the inventory says "+6". And a bit of testing on vanilla minecraft reveal that to 100% be the case.
Here is the incident: I have an iron sword, the guy has zero armor, no golden apples, no nothing. But he doesn't die in 3 hits as he should, he dies in 4. Now okay, its possible that he just healed half a heart as he was getting hit. Except... no. You see: The HP thing above his head (someitmes it appears, sometimes it doesn't, and I have no idea which way it should be, but in this case it was there) showed that he didn't take 3.5 hearts of damage, he took 3. That means that cubecrafts damage is broken on top of the vanilla system being broken OR cubecraft uses an "outdated" system, where iron swords still deal 6 damage instead of a total of 7.
I doubt that its an outdated system, as the server had only recently updated, not to mention that the amount of hits needed to kill a player with each weapon seems to vary and be very inconsistent. As I've had instances where the same situation gave me a kill in only 3 hits. And hard to exactly measure due to regeneration making it hard to predict how many hits a kill is gonna need.
But in the hypothetical scenario we use an old system: it means that on top of the broken damage calculation, we also have an outdated damage system where each weapon deals one damage less than in current vanilla.
Plus, I had only tested Iron armor and iron swords in the old thread, I forgot to test quite literally all other weapons and armors.
Now my plan isn't to test ALL swords and armors, just the ones you are most likely to encounter in eggwars. At least for now.
Imma test:
Iron on nothing, Iron on full leather, Iron on iron, Iron on Diamond,
Diamond on nothing, Diamond on leather, Diamond on Iron, Diamond on Diamond
Netherite on nothing, Netherite on leather, Netherite on Iron and Netherite on Diamond
And the trident on all of these things, just to see if the tridents damage, despite identical base damage to a netherite sword, may be different.
I will only test NORMAL hits, as criticals probably deserve another, equally long post and a separate test session for which I do not have the time for right now.
Speaking of testing: Due to a resource pack I am using (on singleplayer only), I can see hp of mobs (in percentages). And I wanted to try testing the damage with a zombie, as I figured that if it has the same HP as a player (both players and zombies have 20 hp, so 10 hearts, by default), so the damage taken would also be the same if I make the zombie wear the same armor (if anyone wants to know how to do it easily: put armor in a dispenser, then shoot it at a zombie standing right next to the dispenser).
The reason I tried this was because my wifi is kinda terrible on my phone in the room I have my pc in, which makes it hard to test things without lagging out constantly.
Anyway: Because of that I accidentally found out mob damage is calculated differently than player damage, in the sense that its mostly correct.
While on a player with iron armor an iron sword dealt 1.5 hearts of damage in the first hit, then 2 hearts on hits 2, 3 and 4, on a zombie wearing the same armor the same sword dealt 1.5 hearts of damage on all 4 hits.
I am not entirely sure if that's how its supposed to be, but because it is, it means that mobs take longer to kill in terms of the number of hits needed.
Do not worry though, as critical damage is broken on both.
On a player, crits no.1 and 2 each deal 3 hearts of damage instead of the 2-2.5 they are supposed to, and crit no.4 deals 3.5 hearts. Meanwhile, on the zombie, crit no.1 "correctly" deals 2.5 hearts, but crits 2 and 3 deal 3 hearts each.ada
I am not gonna run all of the mentioned tests on zombies and players, though, just players. I only added this part so you know that if you are gonna test it yourself, you gotta need another player, and not a mob and a health-visibility resource pack. The tests, for now, are ran on vanilla MC, because as I determined previously: Damage is broken in all of minecraft.
So, here are the test results for normal hits:
The first column just states which hit it was, the second one states which damage it should be on vanilla 1.20, the third one states which damage it should be on the older damage model (the one cubecraft MAYBE uses).
The fourth column shows the ACTUAL damage dealt.
The damage values displayed here are in HEARTS, and NOT in damage points. To get the damage points count, just double the amount of hearts. Also, this test scenario assumes the player does not heal after any of the hits up until he dies. Killing blows are going to be visibly marked and have reduced values as we don't know their exact damage.
I will also add, at the end of each test unit, how many hits the kill mathematically should have taken.
Iron on nothing:
1. 3.5 (7 points), 3 (6 points), 3.5
2. 3.5, 3, 3.5
3. 3.5, 3, 3 (less because its a kill, so we don't know the exact damage dealt)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 4 hits on the old damage system (from now on simply referred to as "old").
Iron on leather (7 points of armor, so theoretically a 28% reduction in damage):
1. 2.5 (from 5.04 points of damage), 2 (from 4.32 damage), 3
2. 2.5, 2, 3
3. 2.5, 2, 3
4. 2.5, 2, 1 (kill)
should be 4 hits on vanilla, 5 hits on old.
Iron on Iron (15 points of armor, 60% reduction):
1. 1.5 (2.8 damage), 1-1.5 (2.4 damage), 1.5
2. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
3. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
4. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
5. 1.5, 1-1.5, 1.5
6. 1.5, 1-1.5., 1 (kill)
should be 7 hits on vanilla, and 7-10 hits on old.
Iron on Diamond (20 points of armor, 80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.4 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.2 damage), 0.5
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
9. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
10. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 0.5
11. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
should be: 10 or 20 hits, depending on how the game rounds it up, regardless if old or vanilla.
Diamond on nothing:
1. 4 (from 1+7 damage), 3.5 (from 7 damage), 4
2. 4, 3.5, 4
3. 4, 3.5, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Diamond on leather (28% reduction):
1. 2.5-3 (from 5.76 damage), 2.5-3 (from 5.04 damage), 3.5
1. 2.5-3 , 2.5-3 , 3.5
3. 2.5-3, 2.5-3, 3.5 (kill)
should be 4 hits.
Diamond on Iron (60% reduction):
1. 1.5-2 (3.2 damage), 1-1.5 (2.8 damage), 2
2. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2
3. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2
5. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 1.5 (kill)
should be between 5 and 7 hits on vanilla, and between 7 and 10 on old.
Diamond on Diamond (80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.4 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
9. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5 (kill)
should be between 10 and 20 hits.
Netherite on nothing:
1. 4.5 (1+8 damage), 4 (8 damage), 4.5
2. 4.5, 4, 4.5
3. 4.5, 4, 1 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Netherite on leather (28% reduction):
1. 3.5-4 (6.48 damage), 3-3.5 (from 5.78 damage), 4
2. 3.5-4, 3-3.5, 4
3. 3.5-4, 3-3.5, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 3-4 on old.
Netherite on Iron (60% reduction):
1. 1.5-2 (from 3.6 damage), 1.5-2 (from 3.2 damage), 2.5
2. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
3. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5 (kill)
should be 5 to 7 hits.
Netherite on diamond (80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.8 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
should be 10-20 hits.
Trident on nothing:
1. 4.5 (1+8 damage), 4 (8 damage), 4.5
2. 4.5, 4, 4.5
3. 4.5, 4, 1 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Trident on leather (28%):
1. 3.5 (6.48 damage), 3 (from 5.78 damage), 4
2. 3.5, 3, 4
2. 3.5, 3, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 4 on old.
Trident on Iron (60%):
1. 1.5-2 (from 3.6 damage), 1.5-2 (from 3.2 damage), 2.5
2. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
3. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5 (kill)
Trident on Diamond (80%):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.8 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
Conclusions/tl;dr/summary:
1. Damage calculations are broken, each armor point is supposed to grant 4% of damage reduction (source), that appears to rarely ever be the case.
1b. According to the wiki, each heart of damage dealt reduces the effectiveness of the armor by 1 point of armor, so 4% per armor level. This still hardly justifies most of the values though. With 7 damage on an iron sword, that'd make iron armor only 3 armor points weaker, meaning 48% damage reduction. So, on 7 damage, that would mean a consistent 2 hearts of damage at best. Instead, it seems to randomly revert to 1.5 hearts as it pleases.
Another example for 1b: Diamond swords, with 8 damage, meaning a 4 point reduction for diamond, making it 16 points strong (64%), that'd mean 2.88 damage, so 1-1.5 hearts, generally leaning 1.5 hearts. Instead, all but 2 hits only deal 1 heart of damage.
2. Wearing leather armor is equivalent to not wearing any at all on the vanilla damage model, so if cubecraft uses the same one, don't bother buying leather on eggwars.
3. When going up against diamond, diamond swords are only slightly better than iron ones, but netherite is only slightly stronger than diamond. Making a iron to diamond or diamond to netherite jump pointless, with only the iron to netherite upgrade making sense when going up against full diamond armor.
4. Netherite absolutely obliterates anything that isn't full diamond armor.
5. Netherite swords and tridents are 100% the same in normal melee fights.
6. damage seems to be consistent with the number of hits, assuming the opponent doesn't regenerate and doesn't do so too quickly, and if the break between hits doesn't last too long. This means that the value of damage shown at, for example, hit no.7 in diamond on diamond should technically always be the same, as long as the mentioned conditions are met.
Basically, I came to the conclusion that damage calculation is a little messed up, but not just on cubecraft, but in all of minecraft, as armor sometimes appears to protect you from damage less than it should, at least on 1.20.
The conclusion/tl:dr is at the end, in case you want to get any results or learn something out of this.
However, with the amount of effort put into making this, I'd really appreciate if you at least tried to read some of this.
So, why would that need a continuation? Because I had another weird incident in one of my eggwars games. So, I am fighting a guy with an iron sword, which according to someone in that old thread doesn't deal 6 damage, but 1+6, as the swords description in the inventory says "+6". And a bit of testing on vanilla minecraft reveal that to 100% be the case.
Here is the incident: I have an iron sword, the guy has zero armor, no golden apples, no nothing. But he doesn't die in 3 hits as he should, he dies in 4. Now okay, its possible that he just healed half a heart as he was getting hit. Except... no. You see: The HP thing above his head (someitmes it appears, sometimes it doesn't, and I have no idea which way it should be, but in this case it was there) showed that he didn't take 3.5 hearts of damage, he took 3. That means that cubecrafts damage is broken on top of the vanilla system being broken OR cubecraft uses an "outdated" system, where iron swords still deal 6 damage instead of a total of 7.
I doubt that its an outdated system, as the server had only recently updated, not to mention that the amount of hits needed to kill a player with each weapon seems to vary and be very inconsistent. As I've had instances where the same situation gave me a kill in only 3 hits. And hard to exactly measure due to regeneration making it hard to predict how many hits a kill is gonna need.
But in the hypothetical scenario we use an old system: it means that on top of the broken damage calculation, we also have an outdated damage system where each weapon deals one damage less than in current vanilla.
Plus, I had only tested Iron armor and iron swords in the old thread, I forgot to test quite literally all other weapons and armors.
Now my plan isn't to test ALL swords and armors, just the ones you are most likely to encounter in eggwars. At least for now.
Imma test:
Iron on nothing, Iron on full leather, Iron on iron, Iron on Diamond,
Diamond on nothing, Diamond on leather, Diamond on Iron, Diamond on Diamond
Netherite on nothing, Netherite on leather, Netherite on Iron and Netherite on Diamond
And the trident on all of these things, just to see if the tridents damage, despite identical base damage to a netherite sword, may be different.
I will only test NORMAL hits, as criticals probably deserve another, equally long post and a separate test session for which I do not have the time for right now.
Speaking of testing: Due to a resource pack I am using (on singleplayer only), I can see hp of mobs (in percentages). And I wanted to try testing the damage with a zombie, as I figured that if it has the same HP as a player (both players and zombies have 20 hp, so 10 hearts, by default), so the damage taken would also be the same if I make the zombie wear the same armor (if anyone wants to know how to do it easily: put armor in a dispenser, then shoot it at a zombie standing right next to the dispenser).
The reason I tried this was because my wifi is kinda terrible on my phone in the room I have my pc in, which makes it hard to test things without lagging out constantly.
Anyway: Because of that I accidentally found out mob damage is calculated differently than player damage, in the sense that its mostly correct.
While on a player with iron armor an iron sword dealt 1.5 hearts of damage in the first hit, then 2 hearts on hits 2, 3 and 4, on a zombie wearing the same armor the same sword dealt 1.5 hearts of damage on all 4 hits.
I am not entirely sure if that's how its supposed to be, but because it is, it means that mobs take longer to kill in terms of the number of hits needed.
Do not worry though, as critical damage is broken on both.
On a player, crits no.1 and 2 each deal 3 hearts of damage instead of the 2-2.5 they are supposed to, and crit no.4 deals 3.5 hearts. Meanwhile, on the zombie, crit no.1 "correctly" deals 2.5 hearts, but crits 2 and 3 deal 3 hearts each.ada
I am not gonna run all of the mentioned tests on zombies and players, though, just players. I only added this part so you know that if you are gonna test it yourself, you gotta need another player, and not a mob and a health-visibility resource pack. The tests, for now, are ran on vanilla MC, because as I determined previously: Damage is broken in all of minecraft.
So, here are the test results for normal hits:
The first column just states which hit it was, the second one states which damage it should be on vanilla 1.20, the third one states which damage it should be on the older damage model (the one cubecraft MAYBE uses).
The fourth column shows the ACTUAL damage dealt.
The damage values displayed here are in HEARTS, and NOT in damage points. To get the damage points count, just double the amount of hearts. Also, this test scenario assumes the player does not heal after any of the hits up until he dies. Killing blows are going to be visibly marked and have reduced values as we don't know their exact damage.
I will also add, at the end of each test unit, how many hits the kill mathematically should have taken.
Iron on nothing:
1. 3.5 (7 points), 3 (6 points), 3.5
2. 3.5, 3, 3.5
3. 3.5, 3, 3 (less because its a kill, so we don't know the exact damage dealt)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 4 hits on the old damage system (from now on simply referred to as "old").
Iron on leather (7 points of armor, so theoretically a 28% reduction in damage):
1. 2.5 (from 5.04 points of damage), 2 (from 4.32 damage), 3
2. 2.5, 2, 3
3. 2.5, 2, 3
4. 2.5, 2, 1 (kill)
should be 4 hits on vanilla, 5 hits on old.
Iron on Iron (15 points of armor, 60% reduction):
1. 1.5 (2.8 damage), 1-1.5 (2.4 damage), 1.5
2. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
3. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
4. 1.5, 1-1.5, 2
5. 1.5, 1-1.5, 1.5
6. 1.5, 1-1.5., 1 (kill)
should be 7 hits on vanilla, and 7-10 hits on old.
Iron on Diamond (20 points of armor, 80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.4 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.2 damage), 0.5
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
9. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
10. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 0.5
11. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
should be: 10 or 20 hits, depending on how the game rounds it up, regardless if old or vanilla.
Diamond on nothing:
1. 4 (from 1+7 damage), 3.5 (from 7 damage), 4
2. 4, 3.5, 4
3. 4, 3.5, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Diamond on leather (28% reduction):
1. 2.5-3 (from 5.76 damage), 2.5-3 (from 5.04 damage), 3.5
1. 2.5-3 , 2.5-3 , 3.5
3. 2.5-3, 2.5-3, 3.5 (kill)
should be 4 hits.
Diamond on Iron (60% reduction):
1. 1.5-2 (3.2 damage), 1-1.5 (2.8 damage), 2
2. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2
3. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 2
5. 1.5-2, 1-1.5, 1.5 (kill)
should be between 5 and 7 hits on vanilla, and between 7 and 10 on old.
Diamond on Diamond (80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.4 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
9. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5 (kill)
should be between 10 and 20 hits.
Netherite on nothing:
1. 4.5 (1+8 damage), 4 (8 damage), 4.5
2. 4.5, 4, 4.5
3. 4.5, 4, 1 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Netherite on leather (28% reduction):
1. 3.5-4 (6.48 damage), 3-3.5 (from 5.78 damage), 4
2. 3.5-4, 3-3.5, 4
3. 3.5-4, 3-3.5, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 3-4 on old.
Netherite on Iron (60% reduction):
1. 1.5-2 (from 3.6 damage), 1.5-2 (from 3.2 damage), 2.5
2. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
3. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5 (kill)
should be 5 to 7 hits.
Netherite on diamond (80% reduction):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.8 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
should be 10-20 hits.
Trident on nothing:
1. 4.5 (1+8 damage), 4 (8 damage), 4.5
2. 4.5, 4, 4.5
3. 4.5, 4, 1 (kill)
should be 3 hits.
Trident on leather (28%):
1. 3.5 (6.48 damage), 3 (from 5.78 damage), 4
2. 3.5, 3, 4
2. 3.5, 3, 2 (kill)
should be 3 hits on vanilla, 4 on old.
Trident on Iron (60%):
1. 1.5-2 (from 3.6 damage), 1.5-2 (from 3.2 damage), 2.5
2. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
3. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5
4. 1.5-2, 1.5-2, 2.5 (kill)
Trident on Diamond (80%):
1. 0.5-1 (from 1.8 damage), 0.5-1 (from 1.6 damage), 1
2. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
3. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
4. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
5. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
6. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1
7. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1.5
8. 0.5-1, 0.5-1, 1 (kill)
Conclusions/tl;dr/summary:
1. Damage calculations are broken, each armor point is supposed to grant 4% of damage reduction (source), that appears to rarely ever be the case.
1b. According to the wiki, each heart of damage dealt reduces the effectiveness of the armor by 1 point of armor, so 4% per armor level. This still hardly justifies most of the values though. With 7 damage on an iron sword, that'd make iron armor only 3 armor points weaker, meaning 48% damage reduction. So, on 7 damage, that would mean a consistent 2 hearts of damage at best. Instead, it seems to randomly revert to 1.5 hearts as it pleases.
Another example for 1b: Diamond swords, with 8 damage, meaning a 4 point reduction for diamond, making it 16 points strong (64%), that'd mean 2.88 damage, so 1-1.5 hearts, generally leaning 1.5 hearts. Instead, all but 2 hits only deal 1 heart of damage.
2. Wearing leather armor is equivalent to not wearing any at all on the vanilla damage model, so if cubecraft uses the same one, don't bother buying leather on eggwars.
3. When going up against diamond, diamond swords are only slightly better than iron ones, but netherite is only slightly stronger than diamond. Making a iron to diamond or diamond to netherite jump pointless, with only the iron to netherite upgrade making sense when going up against full diamond armor.
4. Netherite absolutely obliterates anything that isn't full diamond armor.
5. Netherite swords and tridents are 100% the same in normal melee fights.
6. damage seems to be consistent with the number of hits, assuming the opponent doesn't regenerate and doesn't do so too quickly, and if the break between hits doesn't last too long. This means that the value of damage shown at, for example, hit no.7 in diamond on diamond should technically always be the same, as long as the mentioned conditions are met.
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