Problems with Enderpreals

[CommunistCactus]

NO IM NOT GOING TO REQUEST EP'S

So... since a lot of people want it and a lot of people don't... I want to see:
What are the main problems with EP's? Why and how would they ruin Eggwars? Why should we NOT add them?

And please, don't just make your point by just making assumptions like "Everyone would rush" and just end it right there. Prove it or something, don't just make assumptions and see it as a fact/
Also "It's too OP" is not a reason, EXPLAIN why it's too OP.

Yay. Kbye.

 

[Mr_Riolu_]

NO IM NOT GOING TO REQUEST EP'S

So... since a lot of people want it and a lot of people don't... I want to see:
What are the main problems with EP's? Why and how would they ruin Eggwars? Why should we NOT add them?

And please, don't just make your point by just making assumptions like "Everyone would rush" and just end it right there. Prove it or something, don't just make assumptions and see it as a fact/
Also "It's too OP" is not a reason, EXPLAIN why it's too OP.

Yay. Kbye.

That's what makes over powered special. ;)

 

[Qin Shihuangdi]

Here's why: An Ender Pearl is a risk free method of attacking bases. I prefer speed mode and bomb jumping because they encourage rushing, unlike Ender Pearls which would discourage it knowing that they can get in easily.

 

[MooTa]

the reason why there is EP on OP it is because there is too many campers with "OP GEARS" but on Normal, the gears aren't that OP.

 

[Twann]

the reason why there is EP on OP it is because there is too many campers with "OP GEARS" but on Normal, the gears aren't that OP.

Exactly!

 

[Gainfullterror]

Enderpearls have little to no risk, and are another reason to delay the game.
I'd prefer something that requires more skill, like wall bridging or TNT jumping as @Donald Trump said.
At least make it somewhat hard to get to them.

 

[Caboozled_Pie]

Exactly!

... As for me, with nothing but a punch bow and leather armour in OP, I'm pretty much as strong as any diamond armor guy.

 

[Thaus]

This is what I said:

Uh how is it not? If you E-Pearl to them, they can just E-Pearl to mid and you'll be stuck there without being able to get better gens at center. The game will just be a game of chasing down people, and does NOT eliminate campers.

Heck ya they do. I've played plenty of games in OP when a camper just enderpearled away right as we got to their island. Now THEY can camp mid and they will get more op. (Like I said above.) Also, it takes just 4 minutes to get 1 enderpearl (with 1.5 stacks of diamonds). If you E-Pearl there and they E-Pearl to mid, they can get more OP at center (as said above) and simply get more diamonds for e-pearls and gear.

Safe bridging is pretty hard to counter still. Not only does it get to an island safely, but it may also contain them at their island so that they can get eliminated. Remember, a camper usually has the disadvantage if they camp. They get less resources (than what you could do at mid) and they are dead once you kill them. Even with a chest, you can easily steal that and eliminate them. The reason why it's in OP is because

A: rushing is nearly impossible as nearly every team will have obsidian in the first 5 minutes.
B: All the items are dirt cheap which makes it easier to camp
C: Since it's so easy to camp, they needed to add something to counter that.
D: Unlike normal, power bows do basically nothing to kill and that does not help against campers.
E: The reason why people camp is usually because they know that they just need E-Pearls to move around and that's why it takes forever for the game to advance even with E-Pearls. Everything is dirt cheap and the armour is broken.

If it was in normal, it would actually break the game.
It would mean that
A: Everyone will camp knowing that they'll just need E-Pearls to move around.
B: It's possible to rush every team as obsidian is fairly expensive.
C: It's not 100% broken in armour like OP, so there doesn't really need something to cut the time down.
D: There are POWER bows for a reason. Those bows can do some serious damage to campers and may
help you to kill them for an easy passage to their base.
E: It IS easier than you think to safebridge and you can always just use a punch or power bow to finish them off.
↑
If this idea was to get implemented, there would only be 1 villager that sells the enderpearls at mid. So this situation wouldn't happen.
One villager at mid that sells E-Pearls. Great idea but then 1 team can just camp MID too. That's worse than base-camping.


There are still a few problems. If that happens in Normal, you can't really survive especially if they can get the first hit on you.
I've personally never seen a person (EVEN a steve or alex) that failed an E-Pearl throw. Most maps with camping problems have large island at which you can easily teleport to.

 

[CommunistCactus]

Here's why: An Ender Pearl is a risk free method of attacking bases. I prefer speed mode and bomb jumping because they encourage rushing, unlike Ender Pearls which would discourage it knowing that they can get in easily.

I still don't know wth bomb jumping is....
So, because enderpreals will discourage rushing it's bad?
Then we should remove punch bows as well, they discourage rushing as well... Oh, and while you are busy removing stuff, just remove obsidian ass well because that also discourages rushing. Yeah, great. And when the game is in the last phase, where everyone has diamonds and everyone with an egg left has obsidian, you can't really rush anymore, especially not on large maps like aztec, so that's not really they problem.

the reason why there is EP on OP it is because there is too many campers with "OP GEARS" but on Normal, the gears aren't that OP.

So... because the gear isn't that OP in normal mode enderpeals are unnecessary?

and are another reason to delay the game.

Imagine this:
You're on the map Aztec and there are like 5 campers on blue with an egg, you have no egg left, but you have enough gear to kill tho whole team with ease, and have basically infinite resources because you dominate mid and upgraded the generators there, however they won't let you come to their island and are watching you constantly with punch bows.
What do you think delays the game more?
A. The punch bows
B. The lack of enderpreals.

Might as well remove punch bows since they delay the game as well, same goes for obsidian.
Enderpreals won't delay the game, they will speed it up, especially on large maps.

I'd prefer something that requires more skill, like wall bridging or TNT jumping as @Donald Trump said.

It's not like camping requires any skill.... So why should attack do?
And wall bridging will only delay the game compared to enderpeals, and you said yourself that that's not good. And wth is TNT jumping? Launching yourself with TNT? because you can't do that in Eggwars.

Uh how is it not? If you E-Pearl to them, they can just E-Pearl to mid and you'll be stuck there without being able to get better gens at center. The game will just be a game of chasing down people, and does NOT eliminate campers.

Easy: You'll have more enderpreals since you have mid, so when it comes down to chasing, you'll win. Problem solved. Plus, if they have an egg, they abandon it when they preal away. You said it yourself:

They get less resources (than what you could do at mid)

Safe bridging is pretty hard to counter still.

Try that on large maps like aztec. yes it's possible, but it's slow and delays the game. It isn't really fun anymore when it comes to that.

A: rushing is nearly impossible as nearly every team will have obsidian in the first 5 minutes.

Ehmmmm.. Rushing is pretty easy, even if they have obsidian. The pickaxes you can buy from 25/40 diamonds cut trough them like butter. Try it on teaparty, you can easily eliminate all eggs withing 15 minutes, just get a good pickaxe andthere you go, problem solved.

C: Since it's so easy to camp, they needed to add something to counter that.

Because it's not like it's easy to camp on normal mode.... All you need is a bow.

A: Everyone will camp knowing that they'll just need E-Pearls to move around.

I highly doubt that.

C: It's not 100% broken in armour like OP, so there doesn't really need something to cut the time down.

There definitely has to be something that cuts the time down on aztec once the game is in the late stages.

D: There are POWER bows for a reason. Those bows can do some serious damage to campers and may
help you to kill them for an easy passage to their base.

Again, large maps. The distance between the island makes dodging an arrows easier than breathing air. If you want to shoot them, you have to get closer, aka a bridge, but then... PUNCH BOWS!!! also, you forgot one of the most important rules of war:
"If the enemy is withing shooting range, so are you".
---------------------------------
TLDR: I'm not pro removing obsidian/punch bows, but it's the same as not adding enderpreals.
Also wth is bomb jumping?

 

[Qin Shihuangdi]

I still don't know wth bomb jumping is....
So, because enderpreals will discourage rushing it's bad?
Then we should remove punch bows as well, they discourage rushing as well... Oh, and while you are busy removing stuff, just remove obsidian ass well because that also discourages rushing. Yeah, great. And when the game is in the last phase, where everyone has diamonds and everyone with an egg left has obsidian, you can't really rush anymore, especially not on large maps like aztec, so that's not really they problem.

So... because the gear isn't that OP in normal mode enderpeals are unnecessary?

Imagine this:
You're on the map Aztec and there are like 5 campers on blue with an egg, you have no egg left, but you have enough gear to kill tho whole team with ease, and have basically infinite resources because you dominate mid and upgraded the generators there, however they won't let you come to their island and are watching you constantly with punch bows.
What do you think delays the game more?
A. The punch bows
B. The lack of enderpreals.

Might as well remove punch bows since they delay the game as well, same goes for obsidian.
Enderpreals won't delay the game, they will speed it up, especially on large maps.

It's not like camping requires any skill.... So why should attack do?
And wall bridging will only delay the game compared to enderpeals, and you said yourself that that's not good. And wth is TNT jumping? Launching yourself with TNT? because you can't do that in Eggwars.

Easy: You'll have more enderpreals since you have mid, so when it comes down to chasing, you'll win. Problem solved. Plus, if they have an egg, they abandon it when they preal away. You said it yourself:


Try that on large maps like aztec. yes it's possible, but it's slow and delays the game. It isn't really fun anymore when it comes to that.

Ehmmmm.. Rushing is pretty easy, even if they have obsidian. The pickaxes you can buy from 25/40 diamonds cut trough them like butter. Try it on teaparty, you can easily eliminate all eggs withing 15 minutes, just get a good pickaxe andthere you go, problem solved.

Because it's not like it's easy to camp on normal mode.... All you need is a bow.

I highly doubt that.

There definitely has to be something that cuts the time down on aztec once the game is in the late stages.

Again, large maps. The distance between the island makes dodging an arrows easier than breathing air. If you want to shoot them, you have to get closer, aka a bridge, but then... PUNCH BOWS!!! also, you forgot one of the most important rules of war:
"If the enemy is withing shooting range, so are you".
---------------------------------
TLDR: I'm not pro removing obsidian/punch bows, but it's the same as not adding enderpreals.
Also wth is bomb jumping?

Bomb jumping is what you said. For 48 gold and 64 iron, you can buy 4 non-igniting TnT, a pressure plate, and a slime block. Try it with bomber kir in skywars.

 

[BalthierTSK_daForumSeeker]

Here's why: An Ender Pearl is a risk free method of attacking bases. I prefer speed mode and bomb jumping because they encourage rushing, unlike Ender Pearls which would discourage it knowing that they can get in easily.

SPEED MODE DON'T SOLVE THE PROBLEM FOR NORMAL EGGWARS.
Bomb Jumping = Using TNT Normally... It is helping the campers, not the rushers

Ender Pealrs? A Risk Free?
Sure, Costing 64 Diamonds each.
And that is wasting a lot of time AND Better armor.
The heck are you calling Risk Free?

You cost 64 diamonds in which you could use to buy diamond armor / God Sword, Yet, you waste it on a 1x use ender pearls.
While your opponent does not need to care about wasting their diamonds on ender pearls at all, and can use those diamonds to get better gears.

YOU CALL THIS RISK FREE?
'--'

Check my signature. tyvm.

 

[BalthierTSK_daForumSeeker]

Enderpearls have little to no risk, and are another reason to delay the game.
I'd prefer something that requires more skill, like wall bridging or TNT jumping as @Donald Trump said.
At least make it somewhat hard to get to them.

As my fellow mod/helper has one says
"Camping is not necessarily a high risk thing is it?"

 

[AboodPlayz]

What are the main problems with EP's? Why and how would they ruin Eggwars? Why should we NOT add them?

Ender pearls COULD cause more camping because people want to buy it on the other hand it is there to get rid of/ make a way to attack those campers
Ender pearls are almost by chance, if you aim to low you may miss your enderpearl, aim too high and you might get where u want to be or miss it because you over shot it, <--- This is how it DOESN'T ruin eggwars because it isn't a 100% guarantee that you will reach the opposing area
We should add them to normal mode but it is also what makes OP special as @Mr_Eevee_MC said, i don't see no big harm to adding it to normal mode but maybe have it as a voting option because not all like it

If you E-Pearl to them, they can just E-Pearl to mid and you'll be stuck there without being able to get better gens at center. The game will just be a game of chasing down people, and does NOT eliminate campers.

not always, anyway if you were being smart you would buy more ender pearls than armor/gear so they run out of them and you could attack them, also why won't u keep with you atleast 5 diamonds to start a diamond gen and get another one? it might make it longer but that is the price to pay if you want an easy way to get to them

 

[Gainfullterror]

As my fellow mod/helper has one says
"Camping is not necessarily a high risk thing is it?"

You're stuck to an island.
If you're the one camping and you attempt to go somewhere, people WILL shoot you.
Even if you manage to make it to another island, they'll take your bridge back.
The risk in camping is that you can't leave your island, unless you want to be screwed over.

 

[BalthierTSK_daForumSeeker]

You're stuck to an island.
If you're the one camping and you attempt to go somewhere, people WILL shoot you.
Even if you manage to make it to another island, they'll take your bridge back.
The risk in camping is that you can't leave your island, unless you want to be screwed over.

Pardon me. But seriously. This is the sole reason why i don't Want to argue about this stuff anymore.
Just.. LOOK AT YOUR REPLY!

Camping : "You're stuck to an Island."
Yeah, The island in which your Egg is.
"If you're the one camping and you attempt to go somewhere, people Will Shoot you"
1. If only all people are that good at using bow.
2. OH GOD, If Camper ever do GO SOMEWHERE. I Won't call them a camper.

k, bye. I have enough Bull Fudge.
Bye.

 

[CommunistCactus]

Bomb jumping is what you said. For 48 gold and 64 iron, you can buy 4 non-igniting TnT, a pressure plate, and a slime block. Try it with bomber kir in skywars.

Tnt doesn't do knockback in Eggwars so launching yourself won't work. Or is that not what you mean?

 

[Gainfullterror]

You're on the map Aztec and there are like 5 campers on blue with an egg, you have no egg left, but you have enough gear to kill tho whole team with ease, and have basically infinite resources because you dominate mid and upgraded the generators there, however they won't let you come to their island and are watching you constantly with punch bows.
What do you think delays the game more?
A. The punch bows
B. The lack of enderpreals.

Okay this is just personal experience:
I never found Aztec being a painful map for campers.
Just get an enchanted apple and build from height limit (with glass)

It's not like camping requires any skill.... So why should attack do?
And wall bridging will only delay the game compared to enderpeals, and you said yourself that that's not good. And wth is TNT jumping? Launching yourself with TNT? because you can't do that in Eggwars.

Camping requires little to no skill.
Throwing an ender pearl also requires little to no skill.
Wall bridging from a strategical spot requires skill.
This means, that the campers "use" less skill overall.
If they still beat you, that means they're good at camping.
Adding an item just to counter 1 strategy is pointless.
Might as well make obsidian cost 10 iron per, to make rushing not as OP.
(Incoming "rushing requires skill though!")
Rushing is a strategy. Camping is a strategy.
One requires more skill than the other, and one may be more annoying than the other.
It really depends on which tactic you find more annoying, Getting rushed or dealing with campers.

You'll have more enderpreals since you have mid, so when it comes down to chasing, you'll win. Problem solved. Plus, if they have an egg, they abandon it when they preal away. You said it yourself:

So go to their island with an ender pearl, then get locked in a 5v1 where your armor will probably break before you die.
Some of them will probably E-pearl away and start camping at mid. What are you going to do then, go after them? Nope. They'll just enderpearl to another spot to camp there.
This is why ender pearls waste a lot more time than punch bows.
As the game progresses, ender pearls will be the reason for the game going longer.

Check my signature. tyvm.

You forgot to add "People who like to have it a challenge and not to make it extremely easy."

 

[Gainfullterror]

1. If only all people are that good at using bow.

So you assume that nobody is in bow range? okay then.

2. OH GOD, If Camper ever do GO SOMEWHERE. I Won't call them a camper.

You think anyone is going to sit around doing literally nothing, thinking the game will end?
Eventually they'll get impatient.

Yeah, The island in which your Egg is.

You don't need to have an egg to camp, or an egg to win for that matter.

Pardon me. But seriously. This is the sole reason why i don't Want to argue about this stuff anymore.
Just.. LOOK AT YOUR REPLY!

Hey don't blame me for not being able to predict what I as a camper would do. I've never camped.

 

[BalthierTSK_daForumSeeker]

So you assume that nobody is in bow range? okay then.


You think anyone is going to sit around doing literally nothing, thinking the game will end?
Eventually they'll get impatient.


You don't need to have an egg to camp, or an egg to win for that matter.



Hey don't blame me for not being able to predict what I as a camper would do. I've never camped.

And which part is risk taking?
And by moving. I Mean, moving to another island.
I know for fudge sakes that they aren't just staying on one block.

And correct.
You can't predict what you would do as a camper, since you have never camped. Or so you say.

 

[CommunistCactus]

Just get an enchanted apple and build from height limit (with glass)

Fun!

Camping requires little to no skill.
Throwing an ender pearl also requires little to no skill.
Wall bridging from a strategical spot requires skill.
This means, that the campers "use" less skill overall.
If they still beat you, that means they're good at camping.

Using a hacked client requires no skill.
Pvping requires skill
This means, that the hackers "use" less skill overall.
If they still beat you, that means they're good at hacking.

Great thought Gainfullterror, great thought.