The Great "Damage Indicator" Debate

[sexy]

I think the best option is 1, there we would all have a certain "advantage" for pvp, so people will stop using labbymod.

 

[20Seth03]

Thats true :)

 

[Sophie]

Solution 2 would be us disabling damage indicators on our server. This is done on a lot of competitive PvP servers, where the server can essentially scramble the health of a player, so you can always see the player at full health from your damage indicators mod.

This is the best solution, imo. Unlike other client-side HUDs, damage indicators provide an objective advantage over other players that borders on unfair. They strip all skill and patience out of choosing your battles, basically telling you in advance whether you're likely to win, or whether you should come back later when your opponent is at a disadvantage.

However, by granting all players a damage indicator, you would be encouraging targeting and cleaning. Gameplay will grind to a halt, as many players begin avoiding everybody who is at full health. I would do this personally, because why wouldn't I? I don't care what's honourable, I care about what will get me the win - and you can't deny that only fighting players who already stand no chance at beating me is a powerful strategy. Any self-respecting player will soon realise this, and begin doing this too. For this reason, I believe we would see a huge rise in camping and evasive gameplay, which would hurt everybody in every PVP gamemode.

Knowing when to start and stop combat is one of the niche skillgaps in Minecraft that make its PvP so fun. We should keep this aspect of the game alive.

 

[Dudu]

Even tho i use indicators, I actually prefer not allowing them in game, imo it takes a bit away from the strategy of the game. If for example you know for sure a player is at 2 hearts after a fight, you would be confident you can just go in and kill them, but if you cannot see his health and were not spectating the whole fight, you cannot be sure how low they are, they may be at 2 hearts or at 8. I think the second option leads to better forward thinking, as you need to plan fights better if you are not sure of the opponent's health, and makes the cleaning culture less prevalent, especially in games like FFA and the boss game "Get the most kills", where damage indicator is super OP as you can steal everyone's kills really easily. Adding it to everyone levels the playing field a bit, but makes killstealing more prevalent. I am not against killstealing, it's a valid strategy, but just having killsteals and no "real PvP" makes things boring quick imo.

 

[Dreamer]

Hmmmmmmm
This poll will have a very big impact on the competitive side of the community and lots of people will be mad about any outcome.
I prefer option 3 but I am pretty ok with option 1 too. Only thing I want to add is this:
Pls make cube's damage indicators toggleable! some players will prefer their own or just none and it might be really messy when you have 2 damage indicators at the same time. Maybe disable it by default and make it an option in the settings menu.

 

[wxzzrd]

Hmmmmmmm
This poll will have a very big impact on the competitive side of the community and lots of people will be mad about any outcome.
I prefer option 3 but I am pretty ok with option 1 too. Only thing I want to add is this:
Pls make cube's damage indicators toggleable! some players will prefer their own or just none and it might be really messy when you have 2 damage indicators at the same time. Maybe disable it by default and make it an option in the settings menu.

I agree but I should be on by default

 

[Dreamer]

ye thats also possible and even more likely to happen.
just make it toggleable :)

 

[remio]

I'll give anyone who votes for option 2 a free hug (100% legit noscam)

 

[wxzzrd]

I'll give anyone who votes for option 2 a free hug (100% legit noscam)

Briber

 

[wxzzrd]

Solution 2 seems the most reasonable but solution 1 seems like the best so no clue :v

So 1 is the best and vote for it obviously

 

[LlTE]

Without thinking, The first Solution is the best.

 

[remio]

So 1 is the best and vote for it obviously

This way you're not gonna be on the hug list :/

 

[Queen Ualala]

Finally my own bossbar.

 

[Sweetenerera]

Why is everyone voting one ._.

 

[ERicKill3R]

Solution 2 makes the most sense.

The problem with HP indicators is that you can actually notice when the saturation of another player is depleted (not regenerating hp anymore). By knowking that, you can take on fights that are convenient to you, making it unfair to the other player. It gets even worse if it is a team based gamemode since you can actually go to the weakest player of the team while normally you would not know that.

Solution 1 would be even worse than solution 3. Not knowing the other player's hp is a crucial part of pvp. In games like eggwars, you sometimes need to take risks with low hp to get resources or even fight another player. Lets say for example that you have better gear than another player, but you are low on hp. You can still pretend to be at full hp and pretend to fight the other player so that they have to leave the area (this is more specific to eggwars). This will be not possible if everyone can see the hp.

Or Solution 4: you can add a voting system prior to the start of the game, let the players of that particular match decide if they want to go with seeing or not other players hp.

 

[Queen Ualala]

@Younisco

Option 4: A setting. IF I enable this setting I will be able to see other players health and they will be able to see mine. If my setting is OFF, neither will I be able to see theirs nor will they be able to see mine.

This will be togglable in the main hub and not during a game.

Scrambling Labymod HP will upset a lot of people so Option 1 is safer.

 

[Story]

This is the best solution, imo. Unlike other client-side HUDs, damage indicators provide an objective advantage over other players that borders on unfair. They strip all skill and patience out of choosing your battles, basically telling you in advance whether you're likely to win, or whether you should come back later when your opponent is at a disadvantage.

However, by granting all players a damage indicator, you would be encouraging targeting and cleaning. Gameplay will grind to a halt, as many players begin avoiding everybody who is at full health. I would do this personally, because why wouldn't I? I don't care what's honourable, I care about what will get me the win - and you can't deny that only fighting players who already stand no chance at beating me is a powerful strategy. Any self-respecting player will soon realise this, and begin doing this too. For this reason, I believe we would see a huge rise in camping and evasive gameplay, which would hurt everybody in every PVP gamemode.

Knowing when to start and stop combat is one of the niche skillgaps in Minecraft that make its PvP so fun. We should keep this aspect of the game alive.

Could not have worded it better myself.

Pushing everyone onto an element of pvp that isn't in the base game is unfair in every regard. Choosing your opponents without knowing their health is a part of the game, it's a risk and therefore a strategy to survey the game as best as you can, but when you simply give that information out to people right in front of them- it just becomes a game of actions figures smashing together and seeing which one breaks first.

Every game can be improved with strategy and I never agree with going in the direction of what modified clients have done but rather towards the vanilla gameplay.

 

[wxzzrd]

Solution 2 makes the most sense.

The problem with HP indicators is that you can actually notice when the saturation of another player is depleted (not regenerating hp anymore). By knowking that, you can take on fights that are convenient to you, making it unfair to the other player. It gets even worse if it is a team based gamemode since you can actually go to the weakest player of the team while normally you would not know that.

Solution 1 would be even worse than solution 3. Not knowing the other player's hp is a crucial part of pvp. In games like eggwars, you sometimes need to take risks with low hp to get resources or even fight another player. Lets say for example that you have better gear than another player, but you are low on hp. You can still pretend to be at full hp and pretend to fight the other player so that they have to leave the area (this is more specific to eggwars). This will be not possible if everyone can see the hp.

Or Solution 4: you can add a voting system prior to the start of the game, let the players of that particular match decide if they want to go with seeing or not other players hp.

Yes solution 4 and anyone can vote @Younisco take a look

 

[Gregeyy]

Finally my own bossbar.

It'd be better to set it in the actionbar (hotbar messages)

 

[Queen Ualala]

Could not have worded it better myself.

Pushing everyone onto an element of pvp that isn't in the base game is unfair in every regard. Choosing your opponents without knowing their health is a part of the game, it's a risk and therefore a strategy to survey the game as best as you can, but when you simply give that information out to people right in front of them- it just becomes a game of actions figures smashing together and seeing which one breaks first.

Every game can be improved with strategy and I never agree with going in the direction of what modified clients have done but rather towards the vanilla gameplay.

Adding DI will ADD to strategy, not take away from it. It will increase coordination amongst rando team members too - one man take a bow, another a health kit; with hearts being seen, dynamic play will become more prominent.

As it is nobody plays the so-called “strategic guessing game” you lobby for. Unless you use a DI mod the game is just “Hit the enemy till they die.”