Tower Defence: Update or Out of Date?

[dartz42]

DISCLAIMER:
YES, I AM RANK 13th ON THE TD LEADERBOARD. NO, IT DOESN'T MATTER.
MAYBE, THOSE WHO INFORMED THESE UPDATE DECISIONS THINK IT DOES.

I feel that I speak on behalf of many long-time players when I say that some concerns must be made known to the changes in this update. The title of this thread should be clear once you read through it.

If you are a new player, or someone who truly cares about this community thriving in the long term, please, do not use these complaints to hate on TD, only to help at improving it.

TLDR - just look at the <underlined> stuff.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tower Mechanics - FINALLY, we have some recognition of poor tower placement on behalf of new players. This is long overdue, but there are clearly discrepancies between this sentiment and what the update ACTUALLY implements:

1. The update was targeted to new players who would have 'auto-centre towers' enabled by default. This is a great idea. But those very same new players do not have tower paths (as they likely don't know which paths/towers to purchase), and thus when choosing to place a towers, WE STILL CANNOT UPGRADE IT FOR THEM. A side effect of this also seems to be that the range restrictions do not apply for these non-path towers, as I have already played many games WITH ICES AND MAGES ADJACENT, which never happened before this update (it did long long ago).
2. The implementation of the auto - centering seems to involve an increased range for players being 'teleported' on top of a tower, when near them. This of course is rather annoying, but more importantly, once can easily spam upgrade towers, pulling players from a 3 block radius onto it. In fact, this makes it possible to literally STUN LOOP PLAYERS ON YOUR BUILDING TOWERS, by building, upgrading, then selling a tower repeatedly.
3. As for the auto-centering, why was it not made IMPOSSIBLE TO MISPLACE TOWERS instead of having an option. To me, this implies a level of value or freedom in being able to misplace, but just not for new players who don't know that value. But this goes against the rules of "intentionally blocking teammates from building towers in Tower Defense" being a punishable offense. IS MISPLACING OKAY, OR IS IT NOT OKAY?

Mobs - Many mob changes have occurred, and it's great to have some more variety! But...

1. Almost all mobs have had some changes, with the exception of zombies and spiders (which are weak, and wouldn't change the game much), Pigmen (which usually don't play a vital role in game wins that aren't quick start), and BLAZES WEREN'T CHANGED, NEITHER WERE ARCHER 2s. It is clear that this is a little odd, as blazes are the most popular strategy for winning games guaranteed, and probably need rebalancing. I of course don't expect this to happen any time soon, but I am rather commenting to the disparity of changes to the most relevant components to TD gameplay at a high level.
2. Moreover, magmas were changed, likely so as to reduce game lag, however, blazes and other mobs in many games since the update have lagged both teams all to 1 bar. I certainly have had many computationally intensive games with thousands of magmas, but if the issue was the lag, then WHY IS THE LAG IT STILL OCCURING? It seems that magmas were debuffed though, making long games less of a threat for those who like to rush wins or damage on castle.
3. ENDERMITES WERE MEGA BUFFED to not be affected by mage, making them a viable strategy for quick wins, especially with bigger parties, meanwhile the update page says little to nothing on this, leaving all of us to just find out.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

In summary, it is clear that some of the suggestions of top players who informed this update have not been met, but some certainly have. Whether that is good is a different question. But at a minimum, the <underlined> stuff in this post should serve as discussion points for future changes, whether they be in the near or far future.

 

[InkAsriel]

As for the auto-centering, why was it not made IMPOSSIBLE TO MISPLACE TOWERS instead of having an option. To me, this implies a level of value or freedom in being able to misplace, but just not for new players who don't know that value. But this goes against the rules of "intentionally blocking teammates from building towers in Tower Defense" being a punishable offense. IS MISPLACING OKAY, OR IS IT NOT OKAY?

i get your point and agree, but also disagree :P misplacing a single tower is not a huge problem, as long as its used to claim this one spot. for example the god-spot for a leach tower, but a teammate who's new to the game loves filling up everything with level 1 necro or turrets.

Almost all mobs have had some changes, with the exception of zombies and spiders (which are weak, and wouldn't change the game much), Pigmen (which usually don't play a vital role in game wins that aren't quick start), and BLAZES WEREN'T CHANGED, NEITHER WERE ARCHER 2s. It is clear that this is a little odd, as blazes are the most popular strategy for winning games guaranteed, and probably need rebalancing. I of course don't expect this to happen any time soon, but I am rather commenting to the disparity of changes to the most relevant components to TD gameplay at a high level.

most people use zombies and spiders for exp farming so these should stay the way they are in my opinion. pigmen... idk, they're just too easy to stop honestly. poison level 4 path 1 really makes they look pointless. blazes could have used a slight debuff or higher price maybe (level 4+ only tho)

 

[CrystalDrop]

Hey Dartz! Hopefully, you remember me! Thank you for these suggestions. I can tell you that the staff team is still working hard on rebalancing a few things for us, and hopefully, we will have a second update in the future with even more new things.

-As for placing a tower, and choosing a path, I was unaware that we can still not upgrade it for them still. I can see how this kind of defeats the purpose.

-Obviously misplacing in the sense of trolling is not okay. We all know there are players once in a while just reserving a few spots or doing a special strategy. (Which is why we have the disable feature + the freedom).

-Endermites are still being reviewed I believe, and talking about blazes and archer towers in the future is a good idea to keep in mind!

 

[ItzEnd3r]

Ok so im just gonna pick out the things that i found important.

as I have already played many games WITH ICES AND MAGES ADJACENT, which never happened before this update (it did long long ago).

This is a bug and hopefully should be fixed soon

As for the auto-centering, why was it not made IMPOSSIBLE TO MISPLACE TOWERS instead of having an option.

You need 20 wins to disable the option, the reasoning for this is because some of the more "professional" players use some strategies, such as switching the place of 5x5 and 3x3s on certain maps which have them back to back. or placing a leach on 3x3s when there isnt a 5x5 spot early on. this is mainly meant to help people who want to place faster and not worry about centering, or to help new players keep towers in their spots.

But this goes against the rules of "intentionally blocking teammates from building towers in Tower Defense" being a punishable offense. IS MISPLACING OKAY, OR IS IT NOT OKAY?

There is a different between misplacing as a strategy and doing it to troll, we can tell the difference and only the trolling one is against the rules.

BLAZES WEREN'T CHANGED, NEITHER WERE ARCHER 2s. It is clear that this is a little odd, as blazes are the most popular strategy for winning games guaranteed, and probably need rebalancing.

Blazes and archer 2s pretty much counter eachother, i have noticed that magma cubes were by far the most used strategy (along with skeletons for quick games) for getting wins, as blazes werent that hard to counter if you have a good team who knows how to set up a defense.

WHY IS THE LAG IT STILL OCCURING?

Personally i have noticed its better, but we cant do anything about entity lag, its a game with a lot of entities all with custom ai so yes, its just laggy by nature and work is being done to reduce the lag.

ENDERMITES WERE MEGA BUFFED to not be affected by mage, making them a viable strategy for quick wins, especially with bigger parties, meanwhile the update page says little to nothing on this, leaving all of us to just find out.

Not mega buffed imo as they still arent good for attack, its just the xp gain that was a big change. Overall i think if the xp was reduced a bit they would fit very well into the game.

Ok so basically remember, there are still gonna be changes made, every major update has balancing changes so im pretty sure some of the smaller issues will be resolved.

 

[Shotgun]

There is a different between misplacing as a strategy and doing it to troll, we can tell the difference and only the trolling one is against the rules.

Agreed and the new Auto Centring definitely helps with making a difference between noobs and trollers. If you see someone placing 5 towers incorrectly then he must have disabled the Auto Centring consciously and is without doubt a troller. And this is imo already a major improvement.

The implementation of the auto - centering seems to involve an increased range for players being 'teleported' on top of a tower, when near them. This of course is rather annoying, but more importantly, once can easily spam upgrade towers, pulling players from a 3 block radius onto it. In fact, this makes it possible to literally STUN LOOP PLAYERS ON YOUR BUILDING TOWERS, by building, upgrading, then selling a tower repeatedly.

We are aware of this but it's a necessity as it solves both problems of being able to place two towers at one spot and the possibility of getting stuck in a tower. If the devs see another way of fixing that, I have full confidence that they'll choose that way.

Almost all mobs have had some changes, with the exception of zombies and spiders (which are weak, and wouldn't change the game much), Pigmen (which usually don't play a vital role in game wins that aren't quick start), and BLAZES WEREN'T CHANGED, NEITHER WERE ARCHER 2s. It is clear that this is a little odd, as blazes are the most popular strategy for winning games guaranteed, and probably need rebalancing. I of course don't expect this to happen any time soon, but I am rather commenting to the disparity of changes to the most relevant components to TD gameplay at a high level.

Pigman are good as they are, Pigmen I are easily defendable with a Poison Top Path but you gotta know that. However, if a team has a Poison Top Path you can still go for the higher levels and I for one know that multiple people use pigman effectively in double income to rush. (Though I don't use them myself) Blaze has been the meta for a long time, I agree. Though nerfing them is not necessary, there have been made changes to the Zeus tower. Having one more tower as a back row option to defend blazes will have huge impact on defence. People just still have to discover this.

ENDERMITES WERE MEGA BUFFED to not be affected by mage, making them a viable strategy for quick wins, especially with bigger parties, meanwhile the update page says little to nothing on this, leaving all of us to just find out.

Endermites are definitely not OP yet. In a game yesterday they were defended pretty easily, we rushed them with Endermite V being with 3 decent players, the opponents were not that good, placed random air def instead of strategic and thought out air defence, but were still able to defend succesfully. Imagine when being in a game with 6v6, Endermite wouldn't be an option then anymore... That's why I think it's not that MEGA BUFFED as you mentioned.

NEITHER WERE ARCHER 2s

I don't see why they need a nerf. Could you explain this part, give a suggestion and describe the consequenses of that change if we were to implement it?

 

[shanewolf38]

There are plenty of things which are still on the path of change. The current changes in general are a compromise of many opinions, so there will be aspects people disagree with. I am definitely on board with archer 2 nerf for sure. Been op way too long. You should join the TD discord (in Shotgun's signature up above)!

 

[dartz42]

I'll respond to each in more detail below. I hope it's clear why I do this here, as I feel more are likely to see it or even maybe care to respond. I'm not interested in making anything private, as this really should be an open discussion.

Scroll to your name for response (or read it all if you're interested!)

InkAsriel:

i get your point and agree, but also disagree :P misplacing a single tower is not a huge problem, as long as its used to claim this one spot. for example the god-spot for a leach tower, but a teammate who's new to the game loves filling up everything with level 1 necro or turrets.

most people use zombies and spiders for exp farming so these should stay the way they are in my opinion. pigmen... idk, they're just too easy to stop honestly. poison level 4 path 1 really makes they look pointless. blazes could have used a slight debuff or higher price maybe (level 4+ only tho)

1. I agree completely, as I have been placing 3x3s more optimally than 5x5s for ages, but my point was that this update makes the lines still as unclear what is the definition of 'trolling.'
2. Again, I agree, out of those 4, I believe only the blazes should have been updated, my point was that the other ones were basically irrelevant to change, but blazes definitely need rethinking.

CrystalDrop:

Hey Dartz! Hopefully, you remember me! Thank you for these suggestions. I can tell you that the staff team is still working hard on rebalancing a few things for us, and hopefully, we will have a second update in the future with even more new things.

-As for placing a tower, and choosing a path, I was unaware that we can still not upgrade it for them still. I can see how this kind of defeats the purpose.

-Obviously misplacing in the sense of trolling is not okay. We all know there are players once in a while just reserving a few spots or doing a special strategy. (Which is why we have the disable feature + the freedom).

-Endermites are still being reviewed I believe, and talking about blazes and archer towers in the future is a good idea to keep in mind!

1. I'm glad to hear that people are working to fix the issue of doubled towers and un-upgradeables.
2. As for trolling, it still seems unclear when it is allowed or not. To go more into this (and honestly it deserves an entire thread), is placing a bunch of 'bad' towers, but placed correctly 'trolling?' Is sending the other team witches to fund them 'trolling?' Or even worse, is building archer IV path 2 on 5x5s, but preventing a loss (and actually winning the game) 'trolling?' It just seems that we don't have the answers as players as of yet.
3. I'm glad endermites are being reviewed, though I do like the sentiment of changing mobs, but it begs the question, will there be new mobs?

ItzEnd3r

Ok so im just gonna pick out the things that i found important.

This is a bug and hopefully should be fixed soon

You need 20 wins to disable the option, the reasoning for this is because some of the more "professional" players use some strategies, such as switching the place of 5x5 and 3x3s on certain maps which have them back to back. or placing a leach on 3x3s when there isnt a 5x5 spot early on. this is mainly meant to help people who want to place faster and not worry about centering, or to help new players keep towers in their spots.

There is a different between misplacing as a strategy and doing it to troll, we can tell the difference and only the trolling one is against the rules.

Blazes and archer 2s pretty much counter eachother, i have noticed that magma cubes were by far the most used strategy (along with skeletons for quick games) for getting wins, as blazes werent that hard to counter if you have a good team who knows how to set up a defense.

Personally i have noticed its better, but we cant do anything about entity lag, its a game with a lot of entities all with custom ai so yes, its just laggy by nature and work is being done to reduce the lag.

Not mega buffed imo as they still arent good for attack, its just the xp gain that was a big change. Overall i think if the xp was reduced a bit they would fit very well into the game.

Ok so basically remember, there are still gonna be changes made, every major update has balancing changes so im pretty sure some of the smaller issues will be resolved.

1. I'm glad, and I hope most bugs will be fixed, and I don't expect it to happen over night.
2. I didn't know there was a cut-off, but as I said, this is a great idea regarding new players, but my concern was for the more experienced ones, how to determine trolling.
3. (see 2)
4. My experience says something entirely different. Blazes are often the method of choice for rushing wins amongst parties, and are exceedingly difficult to defend. But magmas and skeletons both can be defended by enough quake, poison, and sorcs. I can understand that people 'try' to rush wins with skellies, but it has rarely if not never worked well against me or experienced teams, whereas blazes do.
5. Yea, lag is lag, idk, just seemed odd to be lagging out when there were only 60 mobs on the map (and I reiterate that everyone was 1 bar).
6. The XP is one thing sure, but I have already won 5 games with a 2 person endermite strat, at ~7 mins each game. I have no idea how horrifying this would look if there were 6 players, and I don't want to find out. Moreover, it seems a bit odd to just say 'changed completely' on the update info, instead of saying how.
7. Thanks for the time it took to respond, and I'm glad you're looking into it.

Shotgun

Agreed and the new Auto Centring definitely helps with making a difference between noobs and trollers. If you see someone placing 5 towers incorrectly then he must have disabled the Auto Centring consciously and is without doubt a troller. And this is imo already a major improvement.


We are aware of this but it's a necessity as it solves both problems of being able to place two towers at one spot and the possibility of getting stuck in a tower. If the devs see another way of fixing that, I have full confidence that they'll choose that way.


Pigman are good as they are, Pigmen I are easily defendable with a Poison Top Path but you gotta know that. However, if a team has a Poison Top Path you can still go for the higher levels and I for one know that multiple people use pigman effectively in double income to rush. (Though I don't use them myself) Blaze has been the meta for a long time, I agree. Though nerfing them is not necessary, there have been made changes to the Zeus tower. Having one more tower as a back row option to defend blazes will have huge impact on defence. People just still have to discover this.



Endermites are definitely not OP yet. In a game yesterday they were defended pretty easily, we rushed them with Endermite V being with 3 decent players, the opponents were not that good, placed random air def instead of strategic and thought out air defence, but were still able to defend succesfully. Imagine when being in a game with 6v6, Endermite wouldn't be an option then anymore... That's why I think it's not that MEGA BUFFED as you mentioned.


I don't see why they need a nerf. Could you explain this part, give a suggestion and describe the consequenses of that change if we were to implement it?

1. As before, I'm sure it can 'help,' but how can we determine by 'definition' or a 'procedure' for determining trolls. See my response to CrystalDrop point 2 above for more about this.
2. I can understand this, and in fact, I was aware of this, but I feel like a simple redesign of towers for the most part would suffice. Also, the old days had a 'tutorial book' that would tele them out of anywhere they got stuck, which seems like a better solution.
3. Again, I don't believe there should be changes to zombie, spider, or pigmen, I simply mentioned them as comical bystanders to the real culprit. Blazes happen to be the most commonly used strategy for guaranteed wins or touch (in my experience), and I am simply commenting on the peculiarity of not changing them. It's like in many TCGs, and other Esports, when an update occurs, the meta usually changes, but in this case it seems not to.
4. You can say that about endermites... But I had the opposite experience so far (maybe in a total of 20 games). See point 6 response to ItzEnd3r.
5. I'm not sure they need a nerf, but simply am saying that the meta offense, and meta defense has not really changed at all.

Shanewolf38

There are plenty of things which are still on the path of change. The current changes in general are a compromise of many opinions, so there will be aspects people disagree with. I am definitely on board with archer 2 nerf for sure. Been op way too long. You should join the TD discord (in Shotgun's signature up above)!

1. I'm not really saying archer 2 needs a nerf, but tbh I think that most of these problems are really caused by the main thing that needs to be nerfed...
2. Moreover, if you guys think discord will get more involvement in a PUBLIC discussion, I may go there, but I worry that it's less likely to be seen by those who may actually agree with many points, or at least care. Also, you can post the thread to discord as well if you are interested in people seeing it.

 

[dartz42]

To make a separate comment and to further emphasize my point about blazes, refer to the video:

As you can see, with a decent amount of defense (I counted upwards of 80 maxed path 2 archers on our map), blazes still power through. It is curious to me that one of the players on this team (one saying 'imagine just being good at the game' and to top it off 'you will never feel that,' to a player on our team) happens to have been thanked for their contribution to the update.

If anything, archer path 2 clearly needs a buff, or perhaps blaze or even 'big parties' need a nerf. But you can understand the difficulty, when the mod team is being informed by (at least one) player who don't appear to be holding back on using strategies that were unaffected by the update.

More on the big parties here, if you're interested.

 

[Shotgun]

Okay so I know the forums got players that dont do DC and I know DC got players that dont do forums. I think it's 50/50. That's why I'm gonna try to get this a Discord & forums combined discussion. It's really an important thing what we are discussing here. I just saw you joined TD CC already, you will soon see some things pop up in that Discord about this and the other thread.

It's quite late for me rn, so I'll be reacting on everything tomorrow. Just gonna make this known on Discord for now. Have a great evening (assuming that you are from the US)

btw, I noticed that one of your teammates started the conversation with a slightly toxic message... (I also understand where that came from, I wouldn't find it fun either to be destroyed by a party of 5/6 players Though it would be challenging)

 

[qopac]

The update was targeted to new players who would have 'auto-centre towers' enabled by default. This is a great idea. But those very same new players do not have tower paths (as they likely don't know which paths/towers to purchase), and thus when choosing to place a towers, WE STILL CANNOT UPGRADE IT FOR THEM.

This is the main part of the update I disliked and hoped would be fixed (other than the bugs which there's only a few). It punishes EVERYONE on the team, and it makes a more toxic environment to new players who don't understand what they're doing wrong by just placing towers. I think if a player places a tower and they have no path unlocked then anyone on the team with the path unlocked should be able to pick one.

I think the balance changes were good and should be a more regular thing, maybe a balance patch every 3 or so months to keep it a bit fresh and not the same meta for years at a time would be good.

 

[Shotgun]

Again, I agree, out of those 4, I believe only the blazes should have been updated, my point was that the other ones were basically irrelevant to change, but blazes definitely need rethinking.

But when in a game with only individuals in teams who don't know each other, is blaze still a problem then? Or is it just the parties that make them so OP?

As for trolling, it still seems unclear when it is allowed or not. To go more into this (and honestly it deserves an entire thread), is placing a bunch of 'bad' towers, but placed correctly 'trolling?' Is sending the other team witches to fund them 'trolling?' Or even worse, is building archer IV path 2 on 5x5s, but preventing a loss (and actually winning the game) 'trolling?' It just seems that we don't have the answers as players as of yet.

I'll forward this to a Sr. Mod and he'll most likely start a conversation with CapitanGato discussing the matter. I agree that this definitely needs more clarity.

I'm glad endermites are being reviewed, though I do like the sentiment of changing mobs, but it begs the question, will there be new mobs?

Yes there will in all probability, just not this update. It seems kinda odd when three troops are not even touched by 99% of the players and you are still adding a new troop. That's why the existing troops are first being fixed before we add new ones

I'm glad, and I hope most bugs will be fixed, and I don't expect it to happen over night.

They will basically be fixing bugs in the next days, proof that they are already working on it:

The XP is one thing sure, but I have already won 5 games with a 2 person endermite strat, at ~7 mins each game. I have no idea how horrifying this would look if there were 6 players, and I don't want to find out. Moreover, it seems a bit odd to just say 'changed completely' on the update info, instead of saying how.

You can keep up with the how's using this thread, I'll try to keep it as updated as possible.

I have no idea how horrifying this would look if there were 6 players

They would be less horrifying, archers work with AoE, the more players are on both teams the more clutched the mites will be and the more archers the defenders will place. This would result in a weaker push the bigger the teams are.

I'm not sure they need a nerf, but simply am saying that the meta offense, and meta defense has not really changed at all.

I'm gonna be pretty straightforward and honest with you, I tried to change the meta a bit. But there are a lot of people that don't want this. And it's hard to still change it while the community doesnt want it. It also doesnt seem to be the right thing to do. You update games for the community not for yourself.

 

[shanewolf38]

I think archer needs nerf as it's currently a viable counter for almost any defense. There should be more strategy involved than just "spam me". And as for the discord suggestion, it wasn't for posts like this. It's since people involved in the TD community discuss there a lot and the events are really fun.

 

[FoxyFoods]

The whole update is trash, tbh. It limits freedom in creating new strategies that can help you win. There's certain spots where you could place necros one row back (on the row of small tower spots behind it) and place the small towers in front of it - so that you could have archers (since they can't shoot through towers). Another one was where you can place leach close to the start in one of the area that mobs have to walk around - optimizing its range. That is no longer possible, meaning you have to go for all the other trash towers in those OP locations.

Also, people can still spam bad towers, or choose the wrong path. That is also just part of this game. I never get the frustration with new players. Just tell them how they can play better and move on. It also adds an element of difficulty. I always like the challenge.

Plus it's very funny watching salty people who aren't even good at the game themselves lose their minds at noobs. I know this doesn't help my point, but dang it, it was fun. And it happens in every game on cubecraft. You're not going to be able to keep everyone from being salty and misbehaving. People do it in eggwars, among slimes, skywars, everywhere. They get frustrated. Most people on here raging with hormones. They're gonna say some bad stuff and you're not gonna be able to prevent it, besides with chat filter. So just mute them and move on.

On a side note: chat filter, petition to change any bad words for *hugs*? Way cuter and anything actually nice you're saying doesn't get lost without you knowing the other player didn't hear it. I cuss quite a lot but always in a positive way. Like: "Man I *hugs* love this game!" Install *hugs* and save me from myself.

Back to TD. Who, might I ask, WHO thought it was a good idea to improve giants? If anything, giants should have been taken out of the game. They are a lazy idea in the first place.
"Okay team, we need one final boss mob"
"I have an idea"
"Okay John, go."
"Now hear me out, how about... zombies... but... BIGGER?"
* applause *
- Absolute trash.

My point being: right now, the game is boring. The mobs are no longer OP, besides the one mob that is just trash in and of itself. Tower placement is trash. The update genuinely ruined the entire game for me. It took away winning strategies but did not replace them for new strategies to be explored. What the TD community was waiting for was innovation; a step forward in the game. Expansion. Not this step backward, forcing players to play within a bound range of trash strategies, still with the old issues of the game - like new players that don't understand the game.

I have said it before and I will say it again. Tower defense needs a single player mode. You'd solve ALL of the new player issues, while allowing them time to figure it out for themselves. You now ruined a good game by trying to take away these issues. It's not possible, not in a team-setting. You allow players too much freedom, they annoy each other. You don't allow them enough, they can't actually pursue a strategy + others can mess with their towers.

MAKE A SINGLE PLAYER MODE. REWIND THIS UPDATE.

Such a waste. I hope this gets fixed.

My suggestions are:
- do no limit tower placement locations, allow towers to be placed wherever
- ADD A SINGLE PLAYER (1v1) MODE *I cannot stress this enough* -- you can even think of adding 2v2 etc. as well.
- fix the mobs - giants are trash, replace them for something new and funky so people will have fun exploring that. If mobs are too OP, don't make them less OP? Geez.. Make them more expensive, if anything. You need OP mobs for late game.
- just go back the previous version, two versions ago, where you could shift-click and upgrade other people's towers to the path you last used for that tower. If they don't like it, they can remove it again. There used to be some healthy competition then and it was fun as heck. Got more boring last update. Got ultimate boring this update.
- add a new armageddon mode.....the same 3 over and over again gets boring.
- don't make people click on the path in a separate window... it's annoying. Especially for those of us with a bad connection. do you know the additional LAG this causes oml.

Apologies for the rant & length but I just had to get this off my chest. <3

Corona takes away my fun in life and now YOU DO TOO omg please stop. Foxy out.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

[InkAsriel]

The whole update is trash, tbh. It limits freedom in creating new strategies that can help you win. There's certain spots where you could place necros one row back (on the row of small tower spots behind it) and place the small towers in front of it - so that you could have archers (since they can't shoot through towers). Another one was where you can place leach close to the start in one of the area that mobs have to walk around - optimizing its range. That is no longer possible, meaning you have to go for all the other trash towers in those OP locations.

this actually is possible, you can check the settings in game. there should be an option to turn on/off the auto correcting for towers. they added it because of all the griefers, who most of the time never check options :P

On a side note: chat filter, petition to change any bad words for *hugs*? Way cuter and anything actually nice you're saying doesn't get lost without you knowing the other player didn't hear it. I cuss quite a lot but always in a positive way. Like: "Man I *hugs* love this game!" Install *hugs* and save me from myself.

tbh that would be hilarious and wholesome at the same time x3

Back to TD. Who, might I ask, WHO thought it was a good idea to improve giants? If anything, giants should have been taken out of the game. They are a lazy idea in the first place.

giants got buffed as they were always the most trash mob ever. they're just zombies who went trough the puberty and became big and finally succesful :3

My point being: right now, the game is boring. The mobs are no longer OP, besides the one mob that is just trash in and of itself. Tower placement is trash. The update genuinely ruined the entire game for me. It took away winning strategies but did not replace them for new strategies to be explored. What the TD community was waiting for was innovation; a step forward in the game. Expansion. Not this step backward, forcing players to play within a bound range of trash strategies, still with the old issues of the game - like new players that don't understand the game.

the problem with most mobs, they were unbalanced overpowered. the tactics used by most people was rushing, which keeps noobs from learning the game and by that, leave it. i suggested in one of my posts to actually make the first tutorial a Must before playing officially. by this people would get to learn the basics before playing, cuz right now the tutorial isnt too obvious.

I have said it before and I will say it again. Tower defense needs a single player mode. You'd solve ALL of the new player issues, while allowing them time to figure it out for themselves. You now ruined a good game by trying to take away these issues. It's not possible, not in a team-setting. You allow players too much freedom, they annoy each other. You don't allow them enough, they can't actually pursue a strategy + others can mess with their towers.

theres already a small playerbase, this would really ruin teammode (which should be 4v4 in my opinion). if Solo would be added, it shouldnt work with stats as you can easily cheat with a friend or alt.

- just go back the previous version, two versions ago, where you could shift-click and upgrade other people's towers to the path you last used for that tower. If they don't like it, they can remove it again. There used to be some healthy competition then and it was fun as heck. Got more boring last update. Got ultimate boring this update.

lets look at archers for example. people can choose a path and you could upgrade it to lvl3 for them, lvl4 if they unlocked it. i get your point, but im pretty sure it was a glitch.

- add a new armageddon mode.....the same 3 over and over again gets boring.

yes. just yes. would love to see more stuff, but i wonder what could work. but still..
lighning isnt even worth voting for in my opinion, especially not with double income.
wither needs a rework.
horde might need a few small changes, so it kinda builds up in strength.

- don't make people click on the path in a separate window... it's annoying. Especially for those of us with a bad connection. do you know the additional LAG this causes oml.

not only lagg, it uhhh... also makes people like me make stupid mistakes and close the window by accident, so it auto picks a path qwq

 

[Shotgun]

Imo it makes no sense to make new things and keep troops/towers in the game that are never used. That's why this update mostly focused on fixing and next will most likely focus on adding new and exciting stuff.

Thanks for the rant btw l, some things are really helpful but please, research things before yelling them. From reading this I got the feeling that half of it is not properly researched and not build on facts/useful arguments.

Thanks for being honest with us though, we appreciate the time you took to create that msg.