Denied Why memorizing names not on your friend list should be prohibited.

[N_Strak8206]

@R2Sammie gets his Fields Medal.

Niceee

 

[Furzide]

I really hope this is a joke, I don't want my brain to be an illegal modification!!! I love using my brain for an unfair advantage

 

[Furzide]

What?

This suggestion shouldn't even be considered to be implemented. I will quickly talk about why your reasoning behind this suggestion is false. Then after that I will discuss that, even with everything I've mentioned before at that point, the suggestion still cannot be implemented due to human factors and impossibilities around the moderation. Hoshi started a bit about all of these points already, but apparently it wasn't enough to convince you of how ridiculous this idea is.


To quote the CubeCraft's famous rule book about their definition of 'illegal modifications':

"Any client or mod that provides a distinct, gameplay-changing advantage is not allowed."

Memory isn't providing someone a gameplay-changing advantage. If I remember a player because of his crit-spam combat, I can know his name and still being beaten up. Being good makes me remember a player's name, but I can't do anything with that information. For that matter, the complete argument is invalid.
Your response on this would probably be something like:

Then I would say both players have access to this. The only way the 'targetter' has access to the information, is because they played at least once against the 'victim'. You could also say that the information got 'doxxed' via another player, but that makes both of these players 'targetters'. For that matter, that's not what doxxing is (quote rulebook: "Doxxing is defined as sharing any private information without consent, typically for a malicious purpose."). Your playstyle is available for all people to see and if they want to take advantage of that, I don't see why we would hold them back.

It's as if the players are playing a professional soccer match: If they lose the first game, they will most definitely train to become better, better in general but also better against the specific opponent. They would do this by using footage of other matches (information of friends), analysing their own game (studying their playstyle) and training against it. I think that's a good thing. This way, you allow people to become better against good players, which means they become better at the game. Therefore everyone has access to study another player's behavior, which discards the argument that you can have an unfair advantage over another player.

Also, I think Hoshi responded very complete about the ESP comparison, which is obviously false as well. Even if you could convince me of the fact that memory could make you predict where a player is in the game at any time, ESP gives you access to everyone's location without you having to think about it. Memory could get you wrong (the player tries a different strategy), while ESP is straight up having an advantage over everyone in the game by knowing their location.

For what it's worth, I'll come back to the very last line of the first point later on, as you elaborated it later on.

Let's turn this around. Remembering another player's name any longer than a few minutes can lead to amazing situations, such as:

• Friendships outside of your friendlist
• Good conversations
• Clans getting formed
• Easier reports (for example, if someone started trolling in Among Slimes, I could pay more attention to the same person to report them if they break the rules, whereas I wouldn't have paid that much attention if I didn't know I've seen the player before. Same is true for autoclicker, kill-aura etc.)
• Equal Gameplay (many players enjoy gameplay of people of the same level. If I'm not allowed to remember which players are good and which aren't, I will most likely play against random people that are below my skill level (or the other way around).

Besides these advantages, I still disagree with your argumentation about how remembering someone's name can lead to doxxing or hate speech or any of such things.These offenses most likely happen by people that met each other for the first time that game. I kill someone, the killed gets mad. These offenses wouldn't decrease (or increase) with this suggestion getting implemented. First time meeting someone will bring as many toxicity as meeting someone more often in a game.

I wasn't in the mood to copy three screenshots, so this will do I guess lol

This person did nothing wrong. You put him on the forums acting like he committed a crime, while he literally didn't do anything bad. Maybe his next text would be 'I thought that was a very clever play'. For that matter, you tell him he breaks the rules while he literally didn't, while threatening a punishment of 30d ban. If you ask me who's wrong here... But whatever, he remembers you. He didn't insult you, he didn't threaten you. I don't see how this guy should be punished for this screenshot, otherwise you'll make CubeCraft a really boring and restricting place to be.

Don't think about a purple elephant.

Let me guess what you're thinking about. If you force your mind into forgetting things, you automatically think about the thing, and your mind won't let go. It's not that easy to suddenly forget something, and I'm not buying a BrainWasher2000™ for on my desktop.

I don't know about bedrock, but on Java we already have '/ignore' to do exactly this. However, this doesn't stop people from looking at how a player plays the game. And again, what's wrong with that? Analysing players movement can make you better.

For all the mentioned reasons I don't see how that's a bad thing. However, this one caught my eye. Certain combo's and building styles are used by many good players, just because it's a great tactic. If the player has an answer for your combo, I don't see how that is a problem. They grew in their combat style, even if you are the cause of that. You are arguing that players cannot improve themselfs and I think that's the worst 'improvement' CubeCraft could ever make at this point.

Because your memory isn't as great as mine doesn't mean we all forget everything in a matter of seconds. I had a great conversation with someone in-game, as I usually do. From all those conversations, I still remember with whom I had those, as well as when. I also remember the names of great players, because I adjust my strategy on the skill level of my lobby. These aren't 'important events', but I still remember them. Should I be banned now? I don't think so.

This is in my opinion a whole different suggestion. Instead of 'banning memorising names', you could make a suggestion with 'setting up a lobby against a specific team beforehand should not be allowed' and we would have a completely different discussion, where I think you could indeed be right. Who knows?

First of all, this is a hypothesis. It's not proven and it doesn't apply on every human being. I could remember a lot more than a 'normal' person, but even if I remember a little thing such as the name of the crazy moonwalk bridger who killed me last game, which honestly impressed me rather than made me want to trash talk him, and I would bring that up in the next game lobby in the form of 'wow, I saw you building last match, you're really good', I don't think that should be punished at all. And if you say 'only the negative things should be punished, then I wish you the best of luck with moderating as the line from positive to negative is very unclear.

Memory is not a third-party resource. If a player isn't able to move his pinky all the way to the control button, you wouldn't ban players from using the control button, just because not everyone can move their pinky as great as that one player? You're implying it should here...

You should also walk past a bank to rob it, but does that mean no one can walk past a bank anymore? Not breaking the rules shouldn't be punished.

This is exactly the point. Just close CubeCraft, that means no more hackers. Absurd argumentation, which is not false but definitely a bridge too far.
.

Yes, there is some similarity. Agreed. but not seeing difference? Targetting can be really annoying and is per definition a negative thing. For streamers or moderators, this is already a rule, called Stream Sniping. Suggesting targetting should be illegal would have a completely different discussion as mentioned above, but just memorising things is not something you do intentional, is not something you have to use in your gameplay and is not something you should blame on players.

Therefore doxxing is intentionally spreading private information such as your identity. This is different from spreading information such as PvP-style ("Player X is a critspammer, lame" is not something you should ban for, as it is simply not doxxing!!!!)

Also, I want to emphasise the difference between an advantage and an unfair advantage.
Example: I know every EggWars map, with every generator and of some even which color is located where. Does that mean I have an advantage? Yes. Does that mean it's an unfair advantage? No.
Memory isn't an unfair advantage, even though it could help in the gameplay. If your memory isn't that great and you still feel like you cannot use this advantage? Start writing things down. This will help you keeping 'key' information if you really wish to use it.


Now I started already with the last point I would discuss in the thread: The human factor. Simply: where do you draw the line? Is something remembering if I go after the player with the highest rank? They might've been the best, and I might've played with them before, but even if I don't remember that, which would be easy according to your researches and argumentation, would I get punished? The line that can't be drawn would restrict any moderation regarding this suggestion, whereas swearing, hate speech, doxxing, kill-aura or inappropriate skins don't require any discussion.

I think I and everyone else in this thread made clear how this thread has no chance of getting implemented, as it should. CubeCraft should be a fun place to be, not some 1984 place where you cannot think what you want.

bro why are you writing a whole manifesto, it's obvious this guy is baiting

 

[mainixfs]

I'm not kidding. As title says, this should be explicitly prohibited for the following reasons:

• It is an illegal modification/a form of cheating to use memory to remember another player's in-game name, especially a player that is not on the friend list. People are inherently designed to forget names in mere seconds (or minutes if around a certain player for some time), not in hours/days/weeks/months.
  • The reason it's fine on the friend list is because a player can refer to the friend list for a list of names, and because it is likely that the player will run into his/her friends again. It is nearly impossible to run into the same player a second time.
  • It is an unfair advantage because using these memories allows the user to know how other players behave. This is akin to the ESP cheat (a cheat that shows other players' locations) in that it's hard to prove unless the user admits to this. See example below.
  • Since it is an illegal modification, the punishment track must be the same as that for illegal client modifications (using cheats).
• Remembering another player's name any longer than a few minutes can lead to other offenses, such as:
  • Inappropriate messages
  • Hate speech
  • Threats (the offender can write threats to the other player)
  • Impersonation (the offender can remember the other player's name and try to impersonate that player)
  • Doxxing (the offender can dox the other player by using the other player's name and other information)

Here is an example that shows why.

Spoiler: Example

View attachment 211717
View attachment 211718

View attachment 211719

Another player, who is not on my friend list, remembers my behavior. Because of this, he can use my behavior and information against me. Notice that most players don't specifically know about other strangers, as there's no specific information that the former knows about the latter until they cross paths.

EDIT: Grammar.

I don’t think that it should be bannible if u remember them

 

[Rocks1]

First of all this was funny to read Second of all I give a because so what if you remember someone's name. It's not like your going to commit an offense on them because of their name, even if you do no one will find out until the offense is carried out. And if you know how someone plays because you remember their name from a previous match, that isn't unfair, they can do the exact same thing. Also how would this rule be enforced? The only way to find out if someone did it is asking them or them accidentally saying it. This would just result in a lot of false bans. So once again a big

 

[k1ngvenator]

I'm not kidding. As title says, this should be explicitly prohibited for the following reasons:

• It is an illegal modification/a form of cheating to use memory to remember another player's in-game name, especially a player that is not on the friend list. People are inherently designed to forget names in mere seconds (or minutes if around a certain player for some time), not in hours/days/weeks/months.
  • The reason it's fine on the friend list is because a player can refer to the friend list for a list of names, and because it is likely that the player will run into his/her friends again. It is nearly impossible to run into the same player a second time.
  • It is an unfair advantage because using these memories allows the user to know how other players behave. This is akin to the ESP cheat (a cheat that shows other players' locations) in that it's hard to prove unless the user admits to this. See example below.
  • Since it is an illegal modification, the punishment track must be the same as that for illegal client modifications (using cheats).
• Remembering another player's name any longer than a few minutes can lead to other offenses, such as:
  • Inappropriate messages
  • Hate speech
  • Threats (the offender can write threats to the other player)
  • Impersonation (the offender can remember the other player's name and try to impersonate that player)
  • Doxxing (the offender can dox the other player by using the other player's name and other information)

Here is an example that shows why.

Spoiler: Example

View attachment 211717
View attachment 211718

View attachment 211719

Another player, who is not on my friend list, remembers my behavior. Because of this, he can use my behavior and information against me. Notice that most players don't specifically know about other strangers, as there's no specific information that the former knows about the latter until they cross paths.

EDIT: Grammar.

Annoying as it can be, there are two major problems with this idea:

1) There's no real way for the moderators to know if someone is doing this type of thing intentionally unless they make it abundant like your example did; yes, it may be problematic, but there really isn't much that can be done to monitor it.

And 2) You can't just expect people to wipe their own memory of everyone they've come across in the games they play, especially if those same people appear frequently. As an example, I could probably name a fair share of people on Egg Wars Mega that. while I haven't seen them in a while, got burned into my memory simply due to them being very competent players, not that I go after them instantly, I'm just made very weary of their presence; selective memory isn't much a choice, I'm afraid.

 

[N_Strak8206]

bro why are you writing a whole manifesto, it's obvious this guy is baiting

For real, he literally wrote the Old Testament from the Bible

 

[legendaryfox977]

Natha, Hiren and Joe’s homes represent three non-collinear points on a coordinate plane. If they want to meet at a common place such that each one will have to travel the same distance from their homes, how will you decide the meeting point?

Since the points representing the homes are non-collinear, the three points form a triangle.

Now, if you consider the circumcenter of the triangle, it will be equidistant from the vertices. That is, if the circumcenter of the triangle formed by the three homes is chosen as the meeting point, then each one will have to travel the same distance from their home.

so i basically don't think its a smart idea

I want to know what happens next

 

[Deleted member 347571]

@R2Sammie gets his Fields Medal.

 

[byotec]

this is quite possibly the biggest troll in existence

 

[Wauterrr]

While everyone is able to remember something, not everyone is able to have the same stability (see forgetting curve formula) of memories from the same event. While you're not modifying anything to the game, you're using third-party resources that aren't given to you by the current game; this is one category of cheating.

Are you saying that remembering something and using your brain is cheating and using a third party resource...

 

[josepadgui]

Are you saying that remembering something and using your brain is cheating and using a third party resource...

Yes, and he constantly tries to back up this nonsense idea.

 

[betty's oldies]

Yes, and he constantly tries to back up this nonsense idea.

At a glance, it's nonsense. When I was a much younger student, I too took human nature for granted. At that time (7-8+ years ago), if I were to see a suggestion like this, I too would have said it was nonsense, but it was because I didn't understand. But then college came around and I noted the similarities between human behavior and the algorithms I studied (and it so happens that they're also written by us). Since then, my eyes and my mind have opened when I learned that humans are just as programmed as the machines we make. I could write a lot about why this is so and give you a good explanation on the similarities, but that's for another time.

Annoying as it can be, there are two major problems with this idea:

1) There's no real way for the moderators to know if someone is doing this type of thing intentionally unless they make it abundant like your example did; yes, it may be problematic, but there really isn't much that can be done to monitor it.

And 2) You can't just expect people to wipe their own memory of everyone they've come across in the games they play, especially if those same people appear frequently. As an example, I could probably name a fair share of people on Egg Wars Mega that. while I haven't seen them in a while, got burned into my memory simply due to them being very competent players, not that I go after them instantly, I'm just made very weary of their presence; selective memory isn't much a choice, I'm afraid.

#1 would require mind reading (it is possible to read other people's minds).
#2 is already handled naturally (as I stated, other players' names are insignificant and there's only so much that a player can remember at once), but if there's ways to accelerate forgetfulness, that's a plus.

 

[Iridinox]

At a glance, it's nonsense. When I was a much younger student, I too took human nature for granted. At that time (7-8+ years ago), if I were to see a suggestion like this, I too would have said it was nonsense, but it was because I didn't understand. But then college came around and I noted the similarities between human behavior and the algorithms I studied (and it so happens that they're also written by us). Since then, my eyes and my mind have opened when I learned that humans are just as programmed as the machines we make. I could write a lot about why this is so and give you a good explanation on the similarities, but that's for another time.

Ok, this is getting ridiculous. Cubecraft can’t ban people for having minimal control over selective memory. It makes no sense and never have I known a case in which knowing another person‘s name gets someone in legal trouble.

At this point, seeing as the only 2 people who agreed with this suggestion were clearly joking, I believe this thread should be locked; however, I don’t know how to do so and it’s probably not in my power, so we’ll probably have to wait a bit longer for a mod :P

 

[legendaryfox977]

Imagine you went to the cinema and you saw your class mate there will you say hi I remeber you or you will think it’s illegal and you will be punished. See it doesn’t make any sense.

 

[josepadgui]

At a glance, it's nonsense. When I was a much younger student, I too took human nature for granted. At that time (7-8+ years ago), if I were to see a suggestion like this, I too would have said it was nonsense, but it was because I didn't understand. But then college came around and I noted the similarities between human behavior and the algorithms I studied (and it so happens that they're also written by us). Since then, my eyes and my mind have opened when I learned that humans are just as programmed as the machines we make. I could write a lot about why this is so and give you a good explanation on the similarities, but that's for another time.

That's the not the point, the thing is: how are you going to control other people's brain so they can't memorize names? It just doesn't make sense. Apart from this, why should that be punishable?

 

[Deleted member 584093]

so are you going to tell me why you told that guy fake rules?

 

[Matriox]

Can everyone agree to the thread just to see what the admins say if this would be forwarded lol

 

[josepadgui]

Can everyone agree to the thread just to see what the admins say if this would be forwarded lol

That would be funny lol.

 

[Story]

Hi, thanks for the suggestion.

We think it's pretty clear from the community response that won't be implementing this. We agree with many of the responses written.

Denied & locked to prevent further discussion.