Java Overclaiming - Tower Defence

[Shotgun]

Overclaiming - Tower Defence ​

This thread will be focused on a topic @dartz42 brought up in another thread about TD.

Definition​

"The proper placement of 'too many' level 1 towers, so as to claim the defense for other towers or at least for to be upgraded in the future."

Spoiler: Example by Dartz42

The simplest example is the placement of archer (either path) on every single square on a map, but then to sell later and replace or to upgrade later. I wouldn't mind myself if they were path 2, and if they left space for other necessary towers, but I have to be willing to accept some level of claiming.

What's the problem?​

• It blocks other players from building their own kind or style of defence
• The other players are not able to defend properly anymore and therefore end up losing

Solution 1 - Rule​

Creating a sub-rule under trolling which states that the placing of 10 or more towers at level I is punishable.

Solution 2 - Game Mechanic​

Making it so that only 8 towers (level I) of the same kind can be placed. If you'd try placing another one, it will result in the error message "Please upgrade your towers before placing more."

 

[Matriox]

Solution 2 seems the best because it will also teach newer players to upgrade there towers

 

[dartz42]

My only concern with solution 2 is that I feel like it would be a coding nightmare to constantly check who is upgrading your towers and I wouldn't want it to increase lag on tower building either.

 

[Deann]

Okay coming from the perspective of someone who doesn't play TD competitively or really to win (majority of players), having a 5 tower limit before having to upgrade them would be pretty frustrating. When I'm making a defense I'll usually make the front row of archers first, then the back row a different type of tower(s), then upgrade them one by one. It's not to "claim" those spots, it's just the easiest way for me to get my defense laid out. I know I don't play optimally to have the best defense as fast as possible, but the fact is most of the playerbase won't either. Even if it's a bit slower, the way I play works a lot better in my head, and I'm definitely not alone in that. A rule/game mechanic like that would be irritating and honestly put a lot of people off of the game, including me.

I get the problem of overclaiming and there might be a solution out there, but I really don't think this type of rule/mechanic change is worth it.

 

[heavenly55]

I like solution 2, but maybe 5 towers are very few, especially in normal income games. I am also concerned about the lag that this solution can cause, as there is already a problem with td games lagging with mobs.

 

[InkAsriel]

i like placing a line of lvl 1's at first before upgrading them, especially when my teammates are quite annoying, but even worse are the people who refuse to upgrade anything at all. i think solution 2 works the best, and it seems like most people agree :P

 

[zMigi_]

I like solution 2 but maybe increasing the limit a little bit

 

[Shotgun]

Increased limit to 8 (remember it's only for the same type of tower)

 

[Matriox]

i like placing a line of lvl 1's at first before upgrading them, especially when my teammates are quite annoying, but even worse are the people who refuse to upgrade anything at all. i think solution 2 works the best, and it seems like most people agree :P

i actually kinda change my mind, i agree with @InkAsriel i like to place a line of level 1 archers and then later upgrade them its very nice in long games.

So now i guees my opinion is to simply not change the rule bcs i dont see a better option

 

[rezlang]

Solution 2 seems the best because it will also teach newer players to upgrade there towers

Absolutely agree. I find that that most of the time when this issue occurs in my games, the player does not understand why it is an issue. I think having this mechanic be built in would make playing with inexperienced people much more fun.

 

[Shotgun]

What if we would make this a mechanic included in auto centering? So you can toggle it after you have 15 wins?

 

[Deann]

What if we would make this a mechanic included in auto centering? So you can toggle it after you have 15 wins?

I still don't quite see the necessity of it, but if it's toggleable I'd be fine with the addition

 

[rezlang]

What if we would make this a mechanic included in auto centering? So you can toggle it after you have 15 wins?

I like this suggestion much more than just having it be a game rule. It lets people who know what they're doing play how they want, but it also reinforces the necessity of upgrading towers to newer players.

 

[heavenly55]

What if we would make this a mechanic included in auto centering? So you can toggle it after you have 15 wins?

I think this might improve this option. However, people with 15+ wins could still do this to troll.

Maybe increasing the amount of towers that can be level 1 could help with players not seeing this as annoying? I am concerned about normal income games because this is one of the only times that I do this, due to limited income.

Like rezlang mentioned, I think it would be helpful for newer players to learn the importance of upgrading towers, just as much as not misplacing.

I think most td players can agree that if someone builds level 1 archer towers all over a map, they should be banned, since this also prevents other players from building (just as much or maybe even more than misplacing towers).

 

[qopac]

I think it's too small of an issue to warrant such restrictions

 

[heavenly55]

I think it's too small of an issue to warrant such restrictions

I'm curious if it's actually "too small of an issue." I went ahead and asked multiple players in games (mostly randoms) about this issue, and they seem to think that it it's an ongoing issue. I also know of players that have had issues with this in the past. I know that this doesn't represent all td players or that it's not even an accurate percentage of the td player population. However, if any substantial amount of td players are affected by this, I don't think that it should be reduced to it being "too small of an issue."

Although I don't have proof of each instance that it has happened to me, below are some games where this happened just this week.

Spoiler: 1

Spoiler: 2

Spoiler: 3

Spoiler: 4

This by far exceeds the amount of times that someone has misplaced on my map. I personally don't think this is "too small of an issue," especially when it disrupts the gameplay/ interest of players for td, and it can even cost players the game, due to the inability to place towers and properly defend.

 

[qopac]

I'm curious if it's actually "too small of an issue." I went ahead and asked multiple players in games (mostly randoms) about this issue, and they seem to think that it it's an ongoing issue. I also know of players that have had issues with this in the past. I know that this doesn't represent all td players or that it's not even an accurate percentage of the td player population. However, if any substantial amount of td players are affected by this, I don't think that it should be reduced to it being "too small of an issue."

Although I don't have proof of each instance that it has happened to me, below are some games where this happened just this week.

Spoiler: 1

Spoiler: 2

Spoiler: 3

View attachment 186923

Spoiler: 4

View attachment 186924

This by far exceeds the amount of times that someone has misplaced on my map. I personally don't think this is "too small of an issue," especially when it disrupts the gameplay/ interest of players for td, and it can even cost players the game, due to the inability to place towers and properly defend.

Fair enough, I've just been lucky I suppose.