Why team image report SHOULD be allowed

[Shallidor]

Could be confusing, but this is clear, I'm not sure, but how did that one guy have a disc? Or how did you not get the resource pack? xd

There are a few ways to play Lucky Islands without the resources pack. Go in a party and let the party owner (with resource pack installed) join, while you don't have the resource pack, or switch between a normal or lucky islands lobby a few times until you get: 'Failed to install the resource pack' in red letters, then you can just join without.
There might be other ways but these are the ones I experienced.

 

[Younisco]

Explain THIS to me, which I think should be enough to prove beyond any doubt these ***ts were teaming. I left the time on purpose, right corner below.

Sure, they may be teaming, but again, context would be needed. Not sure how hard it is to actually record a player - but it definitely would have a higher success rate than pictures. Other players may just put a screenshot of two players next to each other and claim that it’s teaming which to us may be insufficient - something that will definitely be common if added.

 

[Glaucus7]

Sure, they may be teaming, but again, context would be needed. Not sure how hard it is to actually record a player - but it definitely would have a higher success rate than pictures. Other players may just put a screenshot of two players next to each other and claim that it’s teaming which to us may be insufficient - something that will definitely be common if added.

"higher success" that's not in question. The current justice system doesnt even allow me in making a chance to provide evidence by printscreens.

I don't care what other players do, if you see 'only 2 images' you can simply say it's not enough. But with the evidence I just provided, as example, I think it should be more than enough to pass as valid evidence against those 2 teamers.


Thus proving my point that eventho they are only images it's still posible to show beyond any doubt that they were teaming and therefore there should be an option to allow printscreens to testity against teamers as well.


If you don't agree I will be awaiting your alternative explenation regarding images I previously send as evidence.

 

[SanCookie]

There are a few ways to play Lucky Islands without the resources pack. Go in a party and let the party owner (with resource pack installed) join, while you don't have the resource pack, or switch between a normal or lucky islands lobby a few times until you get: 'Failed to install the resource pack' in red letters, then you can just join without.
There might be other ways but these are the ones I experienced.

Oh, I didn't know these things, thanks for telling them :p Also I remember you, is that possible?

 

[Shallidor]

Oh, I didn't know these things, thanks for telling them :p Also I remember you, is that possible?

And you have leaderboards...:P

And yes , we met in game once and talked for some time, I told you I'd make a forum account soon :)

 

[SanCookie]

And you have leaderboards...:p

And yes , we met in game once and talked for some time, I told you I'd make a forum account soon :)

Ohhh yeah, my auto-GG/Leave mod didn't like me to stay after that game, and the fight was kinda unfair with my pet xd

 

[remio]

Ohhh yeah, my auto-GG/Leave mod didn't like me to stay after that game, and the fight was kinda unfair with my pet xd

Let's stay on topic please.

 

[SanCookie]

Let's stay on topic please.

Yeah let's maybe do that, sorry staff

 

[skifby]

Don't really have to argue about this, it'll simply never happen - for obvious reasons.

 

[Glaucus7]

Don't really have to argue about this, it'll simply never happen - for obvious reasons.

Really, than perhaps you can explain why my evidence, earlier provided, isn't sufficient.

Please explain to us how it isn't obvious that they are teaming inside the images I provided.

 

[Gainfullterror]

To me, it looks like a guy sorting out junk from his inventory & he didn't see the other guy. He picked up the junk again, and then threw it off of the ledge while the other guy was trying to hit him.

Okay, obviously that's not what you see here, but this is pretty much why images are unreliable. There's no context of what has happened nor what is happening at the moment aside from a still image which could literally mean anything. Video evidence is the best way to go about this since you'll be able to understand the context without having to assume anything incorrectly.

 

[Glaucus7]

To me, it looks like a guy sorting out junk from his inventory & he didn't see the other guy. He picked up the junk again, and then threw it off of the ledge while the other guy was trying to hit him.

Okay, obviously that's not what you see here, but this is pretty much why images are unreliable. There's no context of what has happened nor what is happening at the moment aside from a still image which could literally mean anything. Video evidence is the best way to go about this since you'll be able to understand the context without having to assume anything incorrectly.

So I guess he doesn't see him for more then a minute?
The fact you say "obviously that's not what you see here" says enough. The images I provided are more than enough to include the context beyond dispute.

 

[Gainfullterror]

So I guess he doesn't see him for more then a minute?
The fact you say "obviously that's not what you see here" says enough. The images I provided are more than enough to include the context beyond dispute.

When I said "obviously that's not what you see here" I was referring to you. Players could definitely describe the situation as I just did in that screenshot to prove their innocence. I didn't see any obvious loot sharing, any obvious double teaming. It's not like I'd be able to see it with screenshots anyways, as (just like you guessed) there could be dozens of other ways to interpret a screenshot.

 

[Reindeer // Paige]

As stated above by many individuals there are many cases where images are not sufficient. I understand the frustration of many people as some players are clearly teaming but, as stated b Remi. You could take it at a weird time where players are mid-combat and then this would cause a false report. There are many pros and cons to this argument but I mainly believe that staff wish to see sufficient evidence without the chance that the players were not breaking the rules. This is my opinion can clearly happen in this case.

Another factor we must take into account is the fact that if the players appeal I believe staff members are able to put their evidence against a player in their appeal. Personally, I do not believe a screenshot in this instance would be good enough evidence to put against players who have been banned for teaming. This would present many problems and it can cause anger in the staff team as well as the community possibly overtime periods.

I personally, agree with both sides as they have equal argument many of which are valid dearly. However, in this case, I must side with the fact that video evidence is required just for the reason that it is solid. There are no questions asked and Staff will be able to debate and back up their claims with sources and evaluate the situation from the players perspective during the game where teamers have been noticed.​

 

[Injunction]

Explain THIS to me, which I think should be enough to prove beyond any doubt these ***ts were teaming. I left the time on purpose, right corner below.

2 that they want equal gear for a fair fight

 

[Glaucus7]

That would only be allowed IF there are 2 people left. That's not the case in this example.


Uhm, this is a response/reply to jollow250's post above here but for some reason his quote doesnt show? Maybe someone can look into this? The 'Quote' does show in 'edit' ???

 

[Glaucus7]

As stated above by many individuals there are many cases where images are not sufficient. I understand the frustration of many people as some players are clearly teaming but, as stated b Remi. You could take it at a weird time where players are mid-combat and then this would cause a false report. There are many pros and cons to this argument but I mainly believe that staff wish to see sufficient evidence without the chance that the players were not breaking the rules. This is my opinion can clearly happen in this case.

Another factor we must take into account is the fact that if the players appeal I believe staff members are able to put their evidence against a player in their appeal. Personally, I do not believe a screenshot in this instance would be good enough evidence to put against players who have been banned for teaming. This would present many problems and it can cause anger in the staff team as well as the community possibly overtime periods.

I personally, agree with both sides as they have equal argument many of which are valid dearly. However, in this case, I must side with the fact that video evidence is required just for the reason that it is solid. There are no questions asked and Staff will be able to debate and back up their claims with sources and evaluate the situation from the players perspective during the game where teamers have been noticed.​

There can only be 1 reason, not many as you say, and that reason is images don't provide enough context to prove they are actually teaming.

However I don't think this is the case and it would only take me 1 correct example to destroy this entire argument and all legit reasons to prevent cubecraft from using images as evidence against teamers. Tough I believe the main reason they don't want to use images it to prevent spam + a stubborn attitude of pride that fails to pass clear judgment regarding this case. I don't expect staff to admit this.


I personally don't even understand the issue of why it is so big deal not to even provide a way to use images as potential evidence. So what?... 95% will get declined due 'lack of context'. But that last 5% is still teamers that get rightfully punished. Besides the extra work cubecraft would have there wouldn't be any other negative effects. >_>

 

[Nikoshka]

Sometimes, players temporarily team and then one member tricks the other member after teaming for 10 seconds. During those 10 seconds where one player tricks another, I could have taken 2 screenshots showing ‘obvious’ teaming.

Also, the player giving gear to the other player could have been helping him temporarily in order so that they could have a fair fight 1v1 style straight after they had sorted their inventories.

That would only be allowed IF there are 2 people left.

Nahhh,
A quick exchange of gear to make a fight even isn’t teaming. Teaming is when you side by side with another person go around killing other players.

2 screenshots show 2 frames. A whole video shows 100’s and 1000’s of frames. Unless 100 screenshots are presented, screenshot evidence is not enough imo. Mods cannot assume that those two were teaming as there are many unlikely possibilities that may occur and is simply unfair to ban for and they should only ban when they are 100% sure of what they are doing.

I personally don't even understand the issue of why it is so big deal not to even provide a way to use images as potential evidence. So what?... 95% will get declined due 'lack of context'. But that last 5% is still teamers that get rightfully punished. Besides the extra work cubecraft would have there wouldn't be any other negative effects. >_>

95:5 ratio of rejection:acception is awful.
Even still, the ratio would probably actually be 99.9999:0.0001.

The staff team is too small atm to deal with the large amounts of false teaming reports there’d be with screenshots.
Plus, reports are actually reeeaaaalllyyyy boring to go through (unlike contrary belief by members). After doing a few 1000’s of reports, you get super bored. Adding this rule would really suck for staff as they’d have to go through many more reports thus shortening their time as staff as they’d probably resign due to boredom from reports.

There is one way I could see this work:

Use the screenshots and ban the teamer however, if the player claims not to team in their appeal and provides a valid explanation of what they were doing, then they’d be unbanned.

However, this’d just cause confusion and annoyance within moderation.

 

[Glaucus7]

Sometimes, players temporarily team and then one member tricks the other member after teaming for 10 seconds. During those 10 seconds where one player tricks another, I could have taken 2 screenshots showing ‘obvious’ teaming.

Also, the player giving gear to the other player could have been helping him temporarily in order so that they could have a fair fight 1v1 style straight after they had sorted their inventories.

Nahhh,
A quick exchange of gear to make a fight even isn’t teaming. Teaming is when you side by side with another person go around killing other players.

2 screenshots show 2 frames. A whole video shows 100’s and 1000’s of frames. Unless 100 screenshots are presented, screenshot evidence is not enough imo. Mods cannot assume that those two were teaming as there are many unlikely possibilities that may occur and is simply unfair to ban for and they should only ban when they are 100% sure of what they are doing.




95:5 ratio of rejection:acception is awful.
Even still, the ratio would probably actually be 99.9999:0.0001.

The staff team is too small atm to deal with the large amounts of false teaming reports there’d be with screenshots.
Plus, reports are actually reeeaaaalllyyyy boring to go through (unlike contrary belief by members). After doing a few 1000’s of reports, you get super bored. Adding this rule would really suck for staff as they’d have to go through many more reports thus shortening their time as staff as they’d probably resign due to boredom from reports.

There is one way I could see this work:

Use the screenshots and ban the teamer however, if the player claims not to team in their appeal and provides a valid explanation of what they were doing, then they’d be unbanned.

However, this’d just cause confusion and annoyance within moderation.

-There is no "10sec teaming" since that would be a violation.

- Exchanging gear IS a violation since the results could still affect others for as long as there are others in the game.

- I'm not here to discuss the benefits of a movie, I'm familiar with those. I'm here to discuss the possibility to use printscreens as evidence. And I think I've proven my point.

- The ratio really doesn't matter. There still aren't any negative side effects towards the community. And if Cubecraft values their community I think they too believe that every violator caught is a positive thing. Even if it's only one. If they can handle all the 'potential printscreens', that is another question. But then again, I believe cubcraft gets paid by donators to assure cubecrafts existance. This inculdes staff to handle these kind of things.

- "reports are actually reeeaaaalllyyyy boring" I think you too understand this is one of the most worthless arguments I've ever heard. You either choose to be member of staff or not. With it comes responsibility, this included. If you truly thing this is a valid point you should've never be staff to begin with. If they resign because the job is too boring when they do their actual job it would only means cubecraft has the wrong kind of staff.

 

[Nikoshka]

-There is no "10sec teaming" since that would be a violation.

- Exchanging gear IS a violation since the results could still affect others for as long as there are others in the game.

Official Rules:
“Teaming is defined as intentionally working together with an enemy player in a solo mode game.“

It’s not.
If the two pass gear to each other to make a fair 1v1 and quickly fight straight after their quick exchange of gear, they aren’t teaming as they aren’t intentionaly working together.

- I'm not here to discuss the benefits of a movie, I'm familiar with those. I'm here to discuss the possibility to use printscreens as evidence. And I think I've proven my point.

You haven’t really proven your point. In order to get valid evidence, you’d need at least 100+ frames captured.

- The ratio really doesn't matter. There still aren't any negative side effects towards the community. And if Cubecraft values their community I think they too believe that every violator caught is a positive thing. Even if it's only one. If they can handle all the 'potential printscreens', that is another question. But then again, I believe cubcraft gets paid by donators to assure cubecrafts existance. This inculdes staff to handle these kind of things.

Moderation staff don’t get payed.
And the ratio does matter. It means more reports to manage. More reports to deny instead of ones to accept.

The more reports a moderator denies, the more time they waste on denying the report instead of doing something useful and banning a teamer.

- "reports are actually reeeaaaalllyyyy boring" I think you too understand this is one of the most worthless arguments I've ever heard. You either choose to be member of staff or not. With it comes responsibility, this included. If you truly thing this is a valid point you should've never be staff to begin with. If they resign because the job is too boring when they do their actual job it would only means cubecraft has the wrong kind of staff.

It’s not a worthless arguement. It’s actually quite a valid one.
If moderation was a boring job, nobody would choose it. It is voluntary and therefore it must have some aspect of enjoyment in order for moderators to keep doing hard work for Cubecraft.

No fun = No moderators = No reports done.
Moderators don’t just grow on trees (from the saying, money doesn’t grow on trees)